Official: Xanadu Boreholes

[Cedayon]

I have to agree that there are times the individual in office knows better than popular opinion (and vice versa)... whether they are allowed to act on their own in a situation like that is a large part of what determines the actual system of government in place.

In any case, I'm sure the governor can choose inaction in just about anything, similar to how the DIA can veto just about anything in internal affairs... the counterbalance is that someone may try to have them impeached if suitably "unimpressed"

These boreholes aren't that big a deal, though... drill it, don't drill it, whatever...

[Drogue]

Originally posted by TKG
so drug, you think that it's serving the faction as best you can by disobeying its will?

Sometimes. Usually, no, but it can happen. Do the people know all of the long term effects of, say, pollution? Of smoking? Od alcohol? Can they make a truly informed decision? No, they can't. Sometimes, you have to say that the people do not know what is best for them. This is rare, but possible. Hence you should usually follow the peoples wishes, but at times, it may be better to go against them, for long term gain. Moreover, the people will normally choose short term gain, regardless of long term consequences.

These reasons are why, in most nations, you election someone who is more knowledgeable in that specific area, and trust their judgement. As DIA, you can veto any order, even if the people want it, as the Governor can choose not to do something that has been polled. Indeed, this happens often at the changeover between terms, if the incoming Governor does not like what the outgoing one was doing, he can stop and change it. You need the peoples agreement to act, for major things, but not to decide not to act.

[Method]

so drug, you think that it's serving the faction as best you can by disobeying its will?

/me neglects to mention governors don't have to serve the faction as bes they can

[Cedayon]

Originally posted by Maniac
I just checked the constitution. It's not in the governor's job description.

Sure it is, it's right there under "Line his/her pockets liberally with profits skimmed from the market" ... what, you don't see that one either ...

/me takes off his see-the-world-my-way lensed glasses and looks again*

Ohhh, ok, nevermind

[Drogue]

Originally posted by TKG
and drug, if herc becomes the governor, he has an obligation to build that borehole. acting otherwise would not be "serving the faction as best you can" since you are clearly denying the will of the citizens.

Since when do you have to carry through each poll? Especially when that Governor changes over. He could believe he is serving better without building it, and if he is electedd, while saying he won't build it, then that is the people speaking too. You vote for the person and their policies, if you don't like their policies, you don't vote for them.

And as Maniac said, that isn't not in the constitution

[Kassiopeia]

W00t! Keep a lid on the nitpicking, for your own sake, after all, I am the one who nitpicked the Nitpicker's Guide to Evangelion.

[Maniac]

"serving the faction as best you can"

I just checked the constitution. It's not in the governor's job description.

[Method]

Originally posted by Kassiopeia
Btw, could someone tell me how on earth chiron we ended up in this mess in the first place? Who exactly ordered the construction of an unconstitutional borehole?

i believe it was just that the commissioner built the boreholes based on the image i had in the poll, and not by my orders. if you'll look back in the old orders thread. you'll notice i never ordered that borehole, and that it was simply a mistake on the part of the commissioner.

and drug, if herc becomes the governor, he has an obligation to build that borehole. acting otherwise would not be "serving the faction as best you can" since you are clearly denying the will of the citizens.

[Drogue]

Originally posted by Kassiopeia
Ah, so you're saying the AT is impartial and/or twisting the facts?

Not at all, merely that that is his interpretation of the constitution, and he is not a Judge, so is not needed to know the constitution as well. I believe in getting information from the horses mouth, so to speak, and not 3rd party information.

Originally posted by GeneralTacticus
It was not destroyed because no-one ordered it destroyed, and you clearly didn't raise enough of a fuss at the time (and neither did Herc) for it to become a big issue.

Yes, I should have been more forceful. That is true.

Originally posted by GeneralTacticus
Besides, TKG was arguing it was in Aurillion territory anyway.

That is also true, even though his old poll showed differently.

[GeneralTacticus]

Thank you for the clarification. Why was it not removed the first time it was brought up though? I remember saying about it (although not ordering destruction, as I was not Akirian Governor at the time) quite some time ago.

It was not destroyed because no-one ordered it destroyed, and you clearly didn't raise enough of a fuss at the time (and neither did Herc) for it to become a big issue. Besides, TKG was arguing it was in Aurillion territory anyway.

[Kassiopeia]

I suggest your source becoems the constitution rather than the Alpha Talent

Ah, so you're saying the AT is impartial and/or twisting the facts? You are free to quote excerpts of the constitution yourself.

I'll deal with this later, episode 1 awaits

[Drogue]

Originally posted by GeneralTacticus
I missed the one in this thread, and I saw no confirmation from him in the nominations thread as to what he was going to run for.
Election has been posted.

Thank you. For those that wish to vote, the election is here.

Originally posted by GeneralTacticus
I beleive TKG gave orders that the borehole be constructed, which were later retracted due to it's losing the poll, but it was built anyway due to a mistake on my part (I don't actually recall building it, but it's not like I have a good enough memory to recall every one of the thousands of former actions I do each chat).

Thank you for the clarification. Why was it not removed the first time it was brought up though? I remember saying about it (although not ordering destruction, as I was not Akirian Governor at the time) quite some time ago.

[Drogue]

Originally posted by Kassiopeia
If the borehole for the green area wins in this poll, it becomes constitutional, at least that is what it says in the constitution (source: GT in this thread ).

No it doesn't. This poll is not to ratify an old borehole, it is to build a new one. Moreover, as in any RL legal case, it is whether it was constitutional at the time it happen that is the matter. There were different people then, it might not have won the poll. Even more, I asked for it's destruction and was overruled before this poll was even started. The fact I was overruled was unconstitutional, and should not have happened. I suggest your source becoems the constitution rather than the Alpha Talent

Originally posted by Kassiopeia
That's a simple fact. Even if the borehole *was* unconstitutional before, it would be impractical and downright ridiculous to destroy it and then build a new one just to fill the letter of the constitution. And this poll is a way for the DIA to seek ratification for the borehole. I see nothing wrong with this poll, as the right to decide is of the people in the end.

But we are the Peacekeepers, as it says, we rule by constitutiona, even though it is burocratic. Yes it would be impractical, but if that is what the constitution states, then that is what must happen.

Originally posted by Kassiopeia
Btw, could someone tell me how on earth chiron we ended up in this mess in the first place? Who exactly ordered the construction of an unconstitutional borehole?

Well, TKG claims not, thus it must have been either DBTS (IIRC he wa sthe previous Governor of Aurillion) or GT, as Commissioner, with TKG being DIA and thus letting it slide. If it was GT, that is another unconstitutionality, since not only was it not polled (orm was it defeated?) it was not ordered either.

[GeneralTacticus]

And in the Nomination thread he posted that he'd go for any spare position/Governorship.

I missed the one in this thread, and I saw no confirmation from him in the nominations thread as to what he was going to run for.
Election has been posted.

Now, could someone tell me how on earth chiron we ended up in this mess in the first place? Who exactly ordered the construction of an unconstitutional borehole?

I beleive TKG gave orders that the borehole be constructed, which were later retracted due to it's losing the poll, but it was built anyway due to a mistake on my part (I don't actually recall building it, but it's not like I have a good enough memory to recall every one of the thousands of former actions I do each chat).

[Kassiopeia]

If the borehole for the green area wins in this poll, it becomes constitutional, at least that is what it says in the constitution (source: GT in this thread ).

That's a simple fact. Even if the borehole *was* unconstitutional before, it would be impractical and downright ridiculous to destroy it and then build a new one just to fill the letter of the constitution. And this poll is a way for the DIA to seek ratification for the borehole. I see nothing wrong with this poll, as the right to decide is of the people in the end.

Edit - as you can see from the timestamps, this post does not cover the post by Drogue above - and I won't cover it until later, since I'm now going to watch some Evangelion.

Btw, could someone tell me how on earth chiron we ended up in this mess in the first place? Who exactly ordered the construction of an unconstitutional borehole?