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-- FG Hangman 29 (http://apolyton.net/forums//showthread.php?threadid=145073)


Posted by joncha on 06-12-2005 13:05:

FG Hangman 29

Hangman Rules, History and Standings

Rules


Word History:
code:
[word - winner] Communism - FrustratedPoet Utilitarian - joncha Hypnotic - DrSpike Bilious - Jamski Rhythm - DrSpike Jumpy - Jonny Eparchy - DrSpike Euology - alva Airline - Paddy the Scot Sydney - ... Muscular - Theben Plus ones - DrSpike Wrought - joncha Periwinkle - Jonny Hemiplegia - DrSpike Pyrrhic - Zopperoni Dichotomy - vovan Ethereal - joncha Humeral - vovan Nonproliferation - joncha Sclerotium - DrSpike Python - Zopperoni Xylophonist - duke o' york Weltanschauung - Jonny^ Quadripartite - joncha Juxtapose - DrSpike Quizzical - vovan Prerequisite - Jonny Anthocyanin - vovan Clique - Skanky Burns Retrograde - vovan Chromatid - Jonny Monotreme - vovan Clergy - Theben Woozy - DrSpike Prophylaxis - Theben Perpetuity - DrSpike Jokily - ... Quixotic - Zopperoni Juggernaut - DrSpike Jailbird - Paddy the Scot Coarse - Zopperoni Epithelium - duke o' york Buggy - ... Teepee - DrSpike Phlegm - Zopperoni Hybrid - Theben Monotonous - duke o' york Pseud - Caligastia Quantitates - Skanky Burns Coracle - ... Ventilate - joncha Churl - DrSpike Bubbly - Paddy the Scot Unforgiven - DrSpike Jubilant - Jonny Sawyer - DrSpike Impugn - Caligastia Hymnal - Theben Larynx - Zopperoni Wyvern - joncha Frank - ... Wight - ... Changeover - duke o' york Guzzle - ...^(Zopperoni) Dyslexic - Theben Gently - alva^ Schedule - DrSpike Jazzily - ... Buffoon - joncha Shark - DrSpike Quicklime - joncha Clamp - ... Whoever - DrSpike^ Haying - alva^ Check - ... Conception - Jonny Manpower - Theben Hypocotyl - joncha Mescal - Theben Serviced - Rasputin^ Amylogen - joncha Crane - ... March - Japher Infinity - DrSpike Daubed - ... Dizzy - ... Flaccid - duke o' york Blunderbuss - Caligastia Hungry - ...* Vowels - Rasputin Megavars - ...* Boiler - Jonny Market - joncha Gusty - ... Hanged - Zopperoni Phthisical - DrSpike Bulbous - Zopperoni Gymkhana - DrSpike Ghoul - joncha Brash - Jonny Central - Rasputin Manual - Theben Auxotroph - Jonny Zesty - Chaunk Tmesis - DrSpike Idyll - duke o' york Svelt - alva Civilization - Jonny Transpose - Chaunk Winking - ... Disabled - duke o' york Brochure - Paddy the Scot^ Cabernet - joncha Match - Nuclear Master Tedious - DrSpike Budge - kermit_the_frog Unique - alva Column - DrSpike Milky - ... Gabble - vovan Demonic - DrSpike Jackdaw - duke o' york Quetzalcoatl - Skanky Burns Onomatopoeia - DrSpike Which - ... Oxygen - vovan Cyborg - DrSpike Whiff - ... Cashew - duke o' york Gauze - Zopperoni^ Virology - Chaunk Hangman - DrSpike Wavily - Caligastia Uncopyrightable - DrSpike Mummify - Paddy the Scot Passport - DrSpike Pachyderm - Caligastia Bailiff - DrSpike Schism - Skanky Burns Spring - kermit_the_frog Zenith - Skanky Burns Tarring - DrSpike Cough - ... Bugged - Paddy the Scot Assassin - vovan Locust - alva Google - joncha Hardy - ...* Shark - Caligastia Syzygy - vovan Volcano - DrSpike Jawing - ... Kobold - duke o' york Trouble - Theben^ Insinuate - joncha Midge - DrSpike Zygote - Caligastia Gnarly - vovan Dimorph - Theben Philander - Zopperoni^ Wigwam - DrSpike Jagged - ... Baize - ... Jigsaw - duke o' york Questions - Kalius Assumption - joncha^ Drench - ... Krill - Kucinich Lexicon - DrSpike Bucket - ... Nymph - ... Bouyed - Jonny Cowed - DrSpike Judge - duke o' york Gypsophila - vovan Policy - DrSpike Xylology - vovan Philology - Kuciwalker Adder - ... Flash - Paddy the Scot Birthday - Japher Willow - Ljube-ljcvetko Myelin - vovan Mirthless - joncha Bunch - ... Marks - ... Mugger - Chaunk Phallic - duke o' york Popinjay - ...* Synod - joncha Girth - Ljube-ljcvetko Brock - Japher Sufficient - Ljube-ljcvetko Ontogeny - Kuciwalker Llama - duke o' york Infundibuliform - Kuciwalker Flibbertigibit - DrSpike Baggy - ... Jungle - Kuciwalker Furry - ...* Gaggle - ... Bolter - Paddy the Scot Machinist - duke o' york Quarto - civman2000 Vivify - duke o' york Hullo - ...* Hazel - DrSpike^ Mammal - Ljube-ljcvetko Waive - joncha Greed - Jonny Bower - ... Climax - Ljube-ljcvetko Waiver - ... Bowing - joncha Bodily - Paddy the Scot Liberty - DrSpike Jovial - Ljube-ljcvetko Gagger - duke o' york Orotund - Paddy the Scot Classical - DrSpike Mauve - Paddy the Scot Power - Ljube-ljcvetko Foxily - ... ****ing - Heresson Entangle - Ljube-ljcvetko Hexaemeron - civman2000 Gypsum - duke o' york Spike - Ljube-ljcvetko Badger - Jonny Xylem - DrSpike Wizard - Ljube-ljcvetko Huzzah - joncha Jorum - ... Minty - Ljube-ljcvetko Jivey - vovan Acronym - Paddy the Scot Sunbathe - joncha Gamer - Ljube-ljcvetko Wifely - DrSpike Xenia - Ljube-ljcvetko Sobriquet - DrSpike^ Bugle - joncha Brake - Ljube-ljcvetko Hazier - joncha Batch - ... Clank - ... Flunk - Ljube-ljcvetko Jazzer - ... Iambic - vovan Voltaic - joncha Jolts - ... Girth - vovan Alkynes - Sparrowhawk Complex - Ljube-ljcvetko Hawser - duke o' york Parquetry - vovan^ Luscious - DrSpike Fizzy - ... March - Ljube-ljcvetko Hexagon - vovan Grump - Spaced Cowboy^ Hydraulic - joncha Swore - ... Choke - Theben Sloth - Sparrowhawk Clock - joncha Punch - Heresson Yonder - civman2000 Zigzag - Sparrowhawk Puzzle - joncha Jumble - vovan Pointer - joncha Flash - Jonny Smith - joncha Hound - Japher Pistachio - Theben Minimize - Sparrowhawk Pandemic - joncha Orate - vovan Elation - joncha Black - Sparrowhawk Window - Theben Evergreen - civman2000 Jived - ... Paganized - DrSpike^ Foggy - ... Hobby - ... Mucky - ... Havoc - ...* Joker - DrSpike^ Huffy - ... Yardarm - joncha Scoff - Ljube-ljcvetko Khalif - DrSpike* Muggy - ... Fight - Heresson Gambol - DrSpike Dummy - Ljube-ljcvetko Galactic - DrSpike Burgh - joncha Calve - Jonny Uloid - joncha Wails - ... Gaunt - DrSpike Boggy - Sparrowhawk Flower - joncha Hinge - Heresson Vortex - Sparrowhawk Pickle - -Jrabbit Gauche - DrSpike Gulch - ... Bough - ... Fuzzy - Ljube-ljcvetko Vitric - duke o' york Fluffy - DrSpike^ Muddy - joncha Fudge - Paddy the Scot Chink - Ljube-ljcvetko Mitochondrion - duke o' york Bronze - joncha Runic - Ljube-ljcvetko Circumflex - joncha Harden - Ljube-ljcvetko Virus - DrSpike Windy - ... Bobby - snoopy369 Plink - Ljube-ljcvetko Lying - vovan Bibcock - Drogue Synonym - Jonny Octane - Sparrowhawk Phony - Jonny Kilts - vovan Thermos - DrSpike Mulch - Ljube-ljcvetko Fiendish - snoopy369 Curly - joncha Beast - snoopy369 Check - Paddy the Scot Happy - duke o' york Bantam - joncha Finch - ... Hunch - Sparrowhawk White - joncha Flock - Tuberski Lateral - Jonny Ethos - vovan Ravenous - Jonny Gelid - snoopy369 Quick - ... Puffy - DrSpike Dumpy - ... Whack - Ljube-ljcvetko Knocks - joncha Wrong - Drogue Vying - DrSpike Fizzed - ... Jammy - Ljube-ljcvetko Daimyos - snoopy369 Jimmy - ... Grizzle - joncha Prickly - civman2000 Zigzag - Spiffor Merry - snoopy369 Primp - ... Drink - Drogue Complexity - Joncha Buggy - ... Boule - DrSpike Billy - ... Muggy - Ljube-ljcvetko Gingko - Paddy the Scot Pyjamas - Ljube-ljcvetko Quicken - DrSpike Mulch - ... Bobby - Paddy the Scot Chick - civman2000 Qwerty - Drogue Bevvy - ... Kicked - ... Bream - Ljube-ljcvetko* Dower - ... Highlight - joncha Brunch - snoopy369 Grubby - Jonny Honey - Ljube-ljcvetko Dowry - duke o' york Mastiff - Drogue Flight - civman2000 Guzzle - Drogue Dozen - snoopy369^ Lucky - ... Dodger - Sparrowhawk Valve - Ljube-ljcvetko Waver - Sparrowhawk Glazed - Theben Webbed - DrSpike Bauxite - snoopy369 Doyen - ... Plump - ... Chill - Paddy the Scot Sling - ... Bliss - ... Drink - joncha Divvy - ...* Coward - Nimitz Printer - DrSpike Humpy - ... Biddy - Paddy the Scot Gunge - ...* Climb - ... Flirt - ... Bliss - ... Skiff - Ljube-ljcvetko Forum - snoopy369 Mythic - joncha Brush - Ljube-ljcvetko Folia - Paddy the Scot Shine - ... Delay - snoopy369 Exempt - Paddy the Scot Plump - ... Final - ...* Plonk - joncha* Mostly - snoopy369 Funny - DrSpike Boggy - ... Muddy - ... Dummy - duke o' york Tragacanth - joncha^* Grail - snoopy369 Jumpy - ... Worst - joncha Junky - DrSpike Jived - ... Fuggy - ...* Jimmy - ... Baggy - civman2000 Crumby - Ljube-ljcvetko* Tetragrammaton - joncha Hoist - Paddy the Scot Trick - ... Climb - ... Frill - Krill Theatre - Ljube Quirk - joncha Works - duke o' york* Poppy - Nikolai Octagon - joncha Wrack - ... Prong - snoopy369 Sprawl - Paddy the Scot Ivory - snoopy369 Vodka - joncha Musty - ... Punch - Sparrowhawk Glade - snoopy369 Blown - duke o' york Cocky - ... Fixer - ... Squill - DrSpike ***** - ... Drench - joncha^ Hanged - Theben Midnoon - snoopy369* Puzzle - Ljube Oarsmen - joncha Dummy - ... Mobbed - ... Hugger - ... Ketch - Paddy the Scot Bliss - ... Bright - snoopy369 Dumpy - ... Gaudy - James the Scot Password - joncha Jumper - ... Quirt - James the Scot Skill - ... Trade - Sparrowhawk Staff - joncha Pasty - snoopy369 Frock - joncha Drought - snoopy369 Whiff - joncha Frills - James the Scot Wrong - DrSpike Junky - ... Gully - ... Quack - ...^(Ljube) Video - joncha Powder - Jaguar Faqir - ... Ochre - joncha Jigger - Jaguar Noggin - joncha Curst - Jaguar Coccyx - duke o' york* Stage - Nikolai Envious - joncha Galled - Nikolai Pulsometer - DrSpike Zippy - ...^(Jaguar) Zilch - ...* Rangy - Ljube^ Alias - duke o' york Parry - Jaguar Cinch - joncha Dairy - Paddy the Scot Shift - PLATO Eyrir - joncha^ Grand - Jaguar Vexil - DrSpike Gland - ... Fizzy - Rasputin Flavour - joncha Scrag - duke o' york Shank - joncha Pigmy - ... Trick - Chaunk Quoth - joncha Candy - civman2000 Chuff - Ljube Whose - civman2000 Wimpy - ...* Lewdly - joncha^ Brown - DrSpike Bawdy - duke o' york Splash - civman2000 Murky - duke o' york Bothy - Jaguar Riven - DrSpike Jived - Chaunk Adductor - snoopy369 Clump - joncha

... word not guessed
* no point awarded
^ word setter changed

Current Rankings:
code:
1. DrSpike 104 2. joncha 94 3. Ljube-ljcvetko 42 4. Paddy the Scot 35 5. duke o' york 32 6. snoopy369 28 7. vovan 24 8. Jonny 22 9. Theben 16 10. Sparrowhawk 13 11. civman2000 12 12. Zopperoni 11 13. Drogue 8 13. Jaguar 8 15. Caligastia 7 15. Kuciwalker 7 15. alva 7 15. Chaunk 7 19. Skanky Burns 6 20. Rasputin 4 20. Japher 4 20. Heresson 4 20. James the Scot 4 24. Nikolai 3 kermit_the_frog 2 FrustratedPoet 1 Jamski 1 Nuclear Master 1 Kalius 1 Spaced Cowboy 1 -Jrabbit 1 Tuberski 1 Spiffor 1 Nimitz 1 Krill 1 PLATO 1

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If Tehben spits eggs at you, jump on them and throw them back.

Eventis be Yarrr and woo ~ (mostly) error free for 5 days.


Posted by joncha on 06-12-2005 13:07:

civman2000 is driving. Letter guesses of I and L (by snoopy369 and Ljube, respectively) are pending.
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If Tehben spits eggs at you, jump on them and throw them back.

Eventis be Yarrr and woo ~ (mostly) error free for 5 days.


Posted by DrSpike on 06-12-2005 13:13:

Snoopy's spreadsheet gives me 103 btw, as I noted in the other thread. Not saying it's right, just want to know what the discrepancy is.
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Posted by Ljube on 06-12-2005 14:24:

Give DrSpike his point!
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Posted by Rasputin on 06-12-2005 14:32:

cry baby !!
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Posted by joncha on 06-12-2005 15:10:

quote:
Note: standings have not been updated to reflect the results of the recount.

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If Tehben spits eggs at you, jump on them and throw them back.

Eventis be Yarrr and woo ~ (mostly) error free for 5 days.


Posted by DrSpike on 06-12-2005 15:17:

After all your hard work.
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Posted by civman2000 on 06-12-2005 15:33:

Hangman XXIX: Enhanced Graphics Edition

2 guesses remaining.
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"[Columbus's conquests] can also be seen as a bloody atrocity...genocide and slavery." --James Loewen, Lies My Teacher Told Me
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Posted by Chaunk on 06-12-2005 15:35:

U then.
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Posted by civman2000 on 06-12-2005 15:57:

Hangman XXIX: Enhanced Graphics Edition

2 guesses remaining.
__________________
Check out my maps of the world in the ISDG Lexicography thread!
"[Columbus's conquests] can also be seen as a bloody atrocity...genocide and slavery." --James Loewen, Lies My Teacher Told Me
sapIkenak-atAbin inagalasIfi? (Can you speak Inagalasi?) If not, click here and learn how!
PTWDG Roleplay Team: The de la Civ Clan, currently Roberto Menor (in Pamplona) and Caterina Ordonez (in Pamplona). Also: George Finkle, born in the barbarian regions of southern Espana, and Leading S.P.I.N. Correspondent to Espana and the Vatican.


Posted by joncha on 06-12-2005 16:05:

H
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If Tehben spits eggs at you, jump on them and throw them back.

Eventis be Yarrr and woo ~ (mostly) error free for 5 days.


Posted by civman2000 on 06-12-2005 16:10:

Hangman XXIX: Enhanced Graphics Edition

2 guesses remaining.
__________________
Check out my maps of the world in the ISDG Lexicography thread!
"[Columbus's conquests] can also be seen as a bloody atrocity...genocide and slavery." --James Loewen, Lies My Teacher Told Me
sapIkenak-atAbin inagalasIfi? (Can you speak Inagalasi?) If not, click here and learn how!
PTWDG Roleplay Team: The de la Civ Clan, currently Roberto Menor (in Pamplona) and Caterina Ordonez (in Pamplona). Also: George Finkle, born in the barbarian regions of southern Espana, and Leading S.P.I.N. Correspondent to Espana and the Vatican.


Posted by Chaunk on 06-12-2005 16:14:

Chuck?
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Posted by joncha on 06-12-2005 16:22:

So greedy.

A C would have solved it for us...
__________________
If Tehben spits eggs at you, jump on them and throw them back.

Eventis be Yarrr and woo ~ (mostly) error free for 5 days.


Posted by Chaunk on 06-12-2005 16:25:

I know, but a C would solve it for someone else
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Posted by joncha on 06-12-2005 16:25:

Greedy bugger.
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If Tehben spits eggs at you, jump on them and throw them back.

Eventis be Yarrr and woo ~ (mostly) error free for 5 days.


Posted by Ljube on 06-12-2005 16:27:

Then, have another word guess.

chuff
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Posted by civman2000 on 06-12-2005 16:29:

Hangman XXIX: Enhanced Graphics Edition

1 guess remaining.
__________________
Check out my maps of the world in the ISDG Lexicography thread!
"[Columbus's conquests] can also be seen as a bloody atrocity...genocide and slavery." --James Loewen, Lies My Teacher Told Me
sapIkenak-atAbin inagalasIfi? (Can you speak Inagalasi?) If not, click here and learn how!
PTWDG Roleplay Team: The de la Civ Clan, currently Roberto Menor (in Pamplona) and Caterina Ordonez (in Pamplona). Also: George Finkle, born in the barbarian regions of southern Espana, and Leading S.P.I.N. Correspondent to Espana and the Vatican.


Posted by Ljube on 06-12-2005 16:30:

There is another greedy fool whose guess you neglected to count.
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Posted by civman2000 on 06-12-2005 16:33:

Hangman XXIX: Enhanced Graphics Edition

.
__________________
Check out my maps of the world in the ISDG Lexicography thread!
"[Columbus's conquests] can also be seen as a bloody atrocity...genocide and slavery." --James Loewen, Lies My Teacher Told Me
sapIkenak-atAbin inagalasIfi? (Can you speak Inagalasi?) If not, click here and learn how!
PTWDG Roleplay Team: The de la Civ Clan, currently Roberto Menor (in Pamplona) and Caterina Ordonez (in Pamplona). Also: George Finkle, born in the barbarian regions of southern Espana, and Leading S.P.I.N. Correspondent to Espana and the Vatican.


Posted by civman2000 on 06-12-2005 16:33:

And I thought "chuff" would do better than "chunk"...
__________________
Check out my maps of the world in the ISDG Lexicography thread!
"[Columbus's conquests] can also be seen as a bloody atrocity...genocide and slavery." --James Loewen, Lies My Teacher Told Me
sapIkenak-atAbin inagalasIfi? (Can you speak Inagalasi?) If not, click here and learn how!
PTWDG Roleplay Team: The de la Civ Clan, currently Roberto Menor (in Pamplona) and Caterina Ordonez (in Pamplona). Also: George Finkle, born in the barbarian regions of southern Espana, and Leading S.P.I.N. Correspondent to Espana and the Vatican.


Posted by joncha on 06-12-2005 16:34:


__________________
If Tehben spits eggs at you, jump on them and throw them back.

Eventis be Yarrr and woo ~ (mostly) error free for 5 days.


Posted by Ljube on 06-12-2005 16:34:

_ _ _ _ _


5 letters, 10 guesses remaining
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Posted by Chaunk on 06-12-2005 16:35:

Nice guess Ljube

I
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Posted by joncha on 06-12-2005 16:36:

O
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If Tehben spits eggs at you, jump on them and throw them back.

Eventis be Yarrr and woo ~ (mostly) error free for 5 days.


Posted by Ljube on 06-12-2005 16:45:

_ _ O _ _


5 letters, 9 guesses remaining, guessed I


Yeah, thanks Chaunk, I wouldn't have guessed word if you had guessed letter earlier.
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Posted by Jaguar on 06-12-2005 18:42:

l
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The KING OF THE JEWS became the SCOURGE OF THE JEWS, and the SCOURGE OF THE GENTILES, became the KING OF THE GENTILES!~ YES! All by the Cross! "His Blood Be Upon Us and On Our Children! Screamed the Jewry!" - Philosophiser
Given his excellent SIG, I will say that this Jaguar is a man who has wisdom. - Philosophiser


Posted by Jaguar on 06-12-2005 18:43:

Oh, I didn't capitalize that L, but it's bad form to edit guesses. Obviously, it's not an I, because the I in 'poly font has horizontal lines.
__________________
Supporting the 13-2 Indianapolis Colts
Eschewing silly games since December 4, 2005
The KING OF THE JEWS became the SCOURGE OF THE JEWS, and the SCOURGE OF THE GENTILES, became the KING OF THE GENTILES!~ YES! All by the Cross! "His Blood Be Upon Us and On Our Children! Screamed the Jewry!" - Philosophiser
Given his excellent SIG, I will say that this Jaguar is a man who has wisdom. - Philosophiser


Posted by Ljube on 06-12-2005 19:05:

Yes, it's an L.


_ _ O _ _


5 letters, 8 guesses remaining, guessed I, L
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Posted by snoopy369 on 06-12-2005 19:57:

E
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Posted by snoopy369 on 06-12-2005 19:58:

Hmm, that was dumb. I'm tired.
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Posted by Nikolai on 07-12-2005 02:19:

It's an Y. It's allways an Y.
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The LORD your God is with you, he is mighty to save. He will take great delight in you, he will quiet you with his love, he will rejoice over you with singing. - Zephaniah 3:17
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Posted by Ljube on 07-12-2005 05:11:

_ _ O _ E


5 letters, 7 guesses remaining, guessed I, L, Y
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Posted by civman2000 on 07-12-2005 05:16:

C
__________________
Check out my maps of the world in the ISDG Lexicography thread!
"[Columbus's conquests] can also be seen as a bloody atrocity...genocide and slavery." --James Loewen, Lies My Teacher Told Me
sapIkenak-atAbin inagalasIfi? (Can you speak Inagalasi?) If not, click here and learn how!
PTWDG Roleplay Team: The de la Civ Clan, currently Roberto Menor (in Pamplona) and Caterina Ordonez (in Pamplona). Also: George Finkle, born in the barbarian regions of southern Espana, and Leading S.P.I.N. Correspondent to Espana and the Vatican.


Posted by Chaunk on 07-12-2005 05:34:

T

Chuffing spam filter making me type this bit in while I wait
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Posted by Nikolai on 07-12-2005 05:42:

quote:
Originally posted by Nikolai
It's an Y. It's allways an Y.


There was no Y.
__________________
Do not fear, for I am with you; Do not anxiously look about you, for I am your God. -Isaiah 41:10
The LORD your God is with you, he is mighty to save. He will take great delight in you, he will quiet you with his love, he will rejoice over you with singing. - Zephaniah 3:17
Get The List for cIV here!


Posted by Ljube on 07-12-2005 05:46:

But there was an E.


_ _ O _ E


5 letters, 5 guesses remaining, guessed I, L, Y, T, C
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Posted by Zopperoni on 07-12-2005 05:51:

R
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Posted by Nikolai on 07-12-2005 05:57:

P
__________________
Do not fear, for I am with you; Do not anxiously look about you, for I am your God. -Isaiah 41:10
The LORD your God is with you, he is mighty to save. He will take great delight in you, he will quiet you with his love, he will rejoice over you with singing. - Zephaniah 3:17
Get The List for cIV here!


Posted by Ljube on 07-12-2005 06:02:

_ _ O _ E


5 letters, 3 guesses remaining, guessed I, L, Y, T, C, R, P
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Posted by Chaunk on 07-12-2005 06:05:

N
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Posted by Ljube on 07-12-2005 06:10:

_ _ O _ E


5 letters, 2 guesses remaining, guessed I, L, Y, T, C, R, P, N
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Posted by civman2000 on 07-12-2005 06:18:

S
__________________
Check out my maps of the world in the ISDG Lexicography thread!
"[Columbus's conquests] can also be seen as a bloody atrocity...genocide and slavery." --James Loewen, Lies My Teacher Told Me
sapIkenak-atAbin inagalasIfi? (Can you speak Inagalasi?) If not, click here and learn how!
PTWDG Roleplay Team: The de la Civ Clan, currently Roberto Menor (in Pamplona) and Caterina Ordonez (in Pamplona). Also: George Finkle, born in the barbarian regions of southern Espana, and Leading S.P.I.N. Correspondent to Espana and the Vatican.


Posted by Ljube on 07-12-2005 06:21:

_ _ O S E


5 letters, 2 guesses remaining, guessed I, L, Y, T, C, R, P, N
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Posted by civman2000 on 07-12-2005 06:26:

WHOSE
__________________
Check out my maps of the world in the ISDG Lexicography thread!
"[Columbus's conquests] can also be seen as a bloody atrocity...genocide and slavery." --James Loewen, Lies My Teacher Told Me
sapIkenak-atAbin inagalasIfi? (Can you speak Inagalasi?) If not, click here and learn how!
PTWDG Roleplay Team: The de la Civ Clan, currently Roberto Menor (in Pamplona) and Caterina Ordonez (in Pamplona). Also: George Finkle, born in the barbarian regions of southern Espana, and Leading S.P.I.N. Correspondent to Espana and the Vatican.


Posted by Ljube on 07-12-2005 06:32:

yes
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Posted by Rasputin on 07-12-2005 14:54:

clever people ....
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Posted by civman2000 on 07-12-2005 19:04:

Hangman XXIX: Enhanced Graphics Edition

10 guesses remaining.
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Posted by Ljube on 07-12-2005 19:22:

T
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Posted by joncha on 07-12-2005 19:32:

E
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Posted by civman2000 on 07-12-2005 19:44:

Hangman XXIX: Enhanced Graphics Edition

8 guesses remaining.
__________________
Check out my maps of the world in the ISDG Lexicography thread!
"[Columbus's conquests] can also be seen as a bloody atrocity...genocide and slavery." --James Loewen, Lies My Teacher Told Me
sapIkenak-atAbin inagalasIfi? (Can you speak Inagalasi?) If not, click here and learn how!
PTWDG Roleplay Team: The de la Civ Clan, currently Roberto Menor (in Pamplona) and Caterina Ordonez (in Pamplona). Also: George Finkle, born in the barbarian regions of southern Espana, and Leading S.P.I.N. Correspondent to Espana and the Vatican.


Posted by joncha on 07-12-2005 23:15:

Re: FG Hangman 29

Alright, I just finished a manual recount. As you can see, the results don't match either the original tally or the spreadsheet.

Maybe someone else can volunteer to count the points for the players that have conflicting totals (Spike, Ljube, Paddy, duke, Tehben and Ras) to see what they come up with.

code:
Original Spreadsheeted Manual 1. DrSpike 102 103 102 2. joncha 92 92 92 3. Ljube-ljcvetko 43 41 42 4. Paddy the Scot 34 35 35 5. duke o' york 29 30 29 6. snoopy369 27 27 27 7. vovan 24 24 24 8. Jonny 22 22 22 9. Theben 15 16 17 10. Sparrowhawk 13 13 13 11. Zopperoni 11 11 11 11. civman2000 11 11 11 13. Drogue 8 8 8 14. Caligastia 7 7 7 14. Kuciwalker 7 7 7 14. alva 7 7 7 14. Jaguar 7 7 7 18. Skanky Burns 6 6 6 18. Chaunk 6 6 6 20. Rasputin 5 4 4 21. Japher 4 4 4 21. Heresson 4 4 4 21. James the Scot 4 4 4 24. Nikolai 3 3 3 kermit_the_frog 2 2 2 FrustratedPoet 1 1 1 Jamski 1 1 1 Nuclear Master 1 1 1 Kalius 1 1 1 Spaced Cowboy 1 1 1 -Jrabbit 1 1 1 Tuberski 1 1 1 Spiffor 1 1 1 Nimitz 1 1 1 Krill 1 1 1 PLATO 1 1 1

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Posted by Ljube on 07-12-2005 23:23:

I'm not sure I understand. Why do you need to recount something you already recounted before? That's just an invitation for more errors.
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Posted by Ljube on 07-12-2005 23:31:

I can't say for others, but I have 43 points for sure. The spreadsheet missed 2 of my points gained as word setter. I got a total of 4 points as word setter, not 2 as the spreadsheet erroneously reports. Also, I checked my total every time it needed to be updated until it was updated.
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Posted by joncha on 07-12-2005 23:59:

The spreadsheet didn't always count set points properly, and had problems with people who switched usernames, for example.

To clarify, the first set is the numbers we had before I went back through the threads. I know there are some errors with it, because I found discrepancies when I did. The second set is what we got when we entered the updated list into snoopy's spreadsheet. Given the hiccups it has had, there are likely some errors there too. The third set came from sitting down and tallying up the verified list. I am reasonably confident that the numbers in the third set are correct, but it's a long list so I could have made an error or two. That's why I would suggest that someone other than me double check the numbers that don't match.
__________________
If Tehben spits eggs at you, jump on them and throw them back.

Eventis be Yarrr and woo ~ (mostly) error free for 5 days.


Posted by Nikolai on 08-12-2005 01:21:

Y
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The LORD your God is with you, he is mighty to save. He will take great delight in you, he will quiet you with his love, he will rejoice over you with singing. - Zephaniah 3:17
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Posted by Ljube on 08-12-2005 04:42:

quote:
Originally posted by joncha
The spreadsheet didn't always count set points properly, and had problems with people who switched usernames, for example.

To clarify, the first set is the numbers we had before I went back through the threads. I know there are some errors with it, because I found discrepancies when I did. The second set is what we got when we entered the updated list into snoopy's spreadsheet. Given the hiccups it has had, there are likely some errors there too. The third set came from sitting down and tallying up the verified list. I am reasonably confident that the numbers in the third set are correct, but it's a long list so I could have made an error or two. That's why I would suggest that someone other than me double check the numbers that don't match.



Yes, you did make at least one error and that was with the number of my points. The spreadsheet only makes errors in reporting word setter's points. It reports word guesser's points correctly. According to the spreadsheet, I have 38 word guesser points and 2 word setter points equal 40 points. But we all know I have 4 word setter points (waiver, foxily, jazzer and quack) which makes the total in the spreadsheet 42. That total plus my most recent guess chuff sums up to 43.
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Posted by Chaunk on 08-12-2005 05:59:

I just made a small .csv file as a checksum. There have been 525 rounds of hangman, of which 20 did not score points. Therefore, we should have a total of 505 points. In the first column, there are 504, from before the recount. In both the other columns there are 505.

Looking at the lists, and having confirmed Thebem should have 15 points not 16 or 17, I think the only wrong score is Paddy the Scott's, which should be 35. I would put the scores as the following:

code:
1. DrSpike 102 2. joncha 92 3. Ljube-ljcvetko 43 4. Paddy the Scot 35 5. duke o' york 29 6. snoopy369 27 7. vovan 24 8. Jonny 22 9. Theben 15 10. Sparrowhawk 13 11. Zopperoni 11 11. civman2000 11 13. Drogue 8 14. Caligastia 7 14. Kuciwalker 7 14. alva 7 14. Jaguar 7 18. Skanky Burns 6 18. Chaunk 6 20. Rasputin 5 21. Japher 4 21. Heresson 4 21. James the Scot 4 24. Nikolai 3 kermit_the_frog 2 FrustratedPoet 1 Jamski 1 Nuclear Master 1 Kalius 1 Spaced Cowboy 1 -Jrabbit 1 Tuberski 1 Spiffor 1 Nimitz 1 Krill 1 PLATO 1


Oh, and A
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Posted by civman2000 on 08-12-2005 06:09:

Hangman XXIX: Enhanced Graphics Edition

7 guesses remaining.
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"[Columbus's conquests] can also be seen as a bloody atrocity...genocide and slavery." --James Loewen, Lies My Teacher Told Me
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Posted by Ljube on 08-12-2005 06:40:

M
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Posted by duke o' york on 08-12-2005 06:49:

O
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Posted by Nikolai on 08-12-2005 07:06:

I knew there had to be an Y hidden somewhere.
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Do not fear, for I am with you; Do not anxiously look about you, for I am your God. -Isaiah 41:10
The LORD your God is with you, he is mighty to save. He will take great delight in you, he will quiet you with his love, he will rejoice over you with singing. - Zephaniah 3:17
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Posted by joncha on 08-12-2005 11:24:

quote:
Originally posted by Chaunk
I just made a small .csv file as a checksum. There have been 525 rounds of hangman, of which 20 did not score points. Therefore, we should have a total of 505 points. In the first column, there are 504, from before the recount. In both the other columns there are 505.

Looking at the lists, and having confirmed Thebem should have 15 points not 16 or 17, I think the only wrong score is Paddy the Scott's, which should be 35. I would put the scores as the following:

code:
1. DrSpike 102 2. joncha 92 3. Ljube-ljcvetko 43 4. Paddy the Scot 35 5. duke o' york 29 6. snoopy369 27 7. vovan 24 8. Jonny 22 9. Theben 15 10. Sparrowhawk 13 11. Zopperoni 11 11. civman2000 11 13. Drogue 8 14. Caligastia 7 14. Kuciwalker 7 14. alva 7 14. Jaguar 7 18. Skanky Burns 6 18. Chaunk 6 20. Rasputin 5 21. Japher 4 21. Heresson 4 21. James the Scot 4 24. Nikolai 3 kermit_the_frog 2 FrustratedPoet 1 Jamski 1 Nuclear Master 1 Kalius 1 Spaced Cowboy 1 -Jrabbit 1 Tuberski 1 Spiffor 1 Nimitz 1 Krill 1 PLATO 1


Oh, and A


Well... here are Tehben's words. I count 16.

code:
[word - winner] Muscular - Theben Clergy - Theben Prophylaxis - Theben Hybrid - Theben Hymnal - Theben Dyslexic - Theben Manpower - Theben Mescal - Theben Manual - Theben Trouble - Theben^ Dimorph - Theben Choke - Theben Pistachio - Theben Window - Theben Glazed - Theben Hanged - Theben

(the ^ just means that the word setter was different from the previous winner)
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Posted by Chaunk on 08-12-2005 12:43:

Well that forced me to recount the whole lot

code:
DrSpike 101 joncha 92 Ljube-ljcvetko 42 Paddy the Scot 35 duke o' york 30 snoopy369 27 vovan 24 Jonny 22 Theben 16 Sparrowhawk 13 Zopperoni 11 civman2000 11 Drogue 9 Kuciwalker 7 Caligastia 7 alva 7 Jaguar 7 Skanky Burns 6 Chaunk 6 Rasputin 4 Japher 4 James the Scot 4 Heresson 4 Nikolai 3 kermit_the_frog 2 Jamski 1 FrustratedPoet 1 -Jrabbit 1 Tuberski 1 Spiffor 1 Nimitz 1 Krill 1 Kalius 1 Spaced Cowboy 1 PLATO 1 Nuclear Master 1


Some people have moved up, some down. Also attatched is the spreadsheet I've used to make the list.

Please note the spreadsheet was made in openoffice, which is a hideous piece of software, so it may not work in your prefered software package.
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Posted by duke o' york on 08-12-2005 13:24:

I steal your points DrSpike! :muhahahaha:
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Posted by DrSpike on 08-12-2005 13:57:

quote:
Originally posted by joncha
The spreadsheet didn't always count set points properly, and had problems with people who switched usernames, for example.

To clarify, the first set is the numbers we had before I went back through the threads. I know there are some errors with it, because I found discrepancies when I did. The second set is what we got when we entered the updated list into snoopy's spreadsheet. Given the hiccups it has had, there are likely some errors there too. The third set came from sitting down and tallying up the verified list. I am reasonably confident that the numbers in the third set are correct, but it's a long list so I could have made an error or two. That's why I would suggest that someone other than me double check the numbers that don't match.


Personally I don't trust the spreadsheeted methods. If you went through manually and verified the totals I think we should use those, even if it does knock a point from my score on Snoopy's spreadsheet.
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Posted by civman2000 on 08-12-2005 16:10:

Hangman XXIX: Enhanced Graphics Edition

6 guesses remaining.
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Posted by Chaunk on 08-12-2005 16:11:

R
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Posted by joncha on 08-12-2005 16:15:

P
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Posted by Rasputin on 08-12-2005 16:35:

wow spread sheet calculators and such like, this game had gotten very serious
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Posted by civman2000 on 08-12-2005 16:37:

Hangman XXIX: Enhanced Graphics Edition

5 guesses remaining.
__________________
Check out my maps of the world in the ISDG Lexicography thread!
"[Columbus's conquests] can also be seen as a bloody atrocity...genocide and slavery." --James Loewen, Lies My Teacher Told Me
sapIkenak-atAbin inagalasIfi? (Can you speak Inagalasi?) If not, click here and learn how!
PTWDG Roleplay Team: The de la Civ Clan, currently Roberto Menor (in Pamplona) and Caterina Ordonez (in Pamplona). Also: George Finkle, born in the barbarian regions of southern Espana, and Leading S.P.I.N. Correspondent to Espana and the Vatican.


Posted by Chaunk on 08-12-2005 16:39:

LUMPY
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Posted by joncha on 08-12-2005 16:39:

Five guesses remaining and there are probably at most five possible words out there, so...

JUMPY
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Posted by Chaunk on 08-12-2005 16:40:

My thoughts exactly

I can't think of any other than the two we picked.

Edit: Oops, yep I can lol.
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Posted by joncha on 08-12-2005 16:41:

I can.
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Posted by civman2000 on 08-12-2005 16:45:

Hangman XXIX: Enhanced Graphics Edition

3 guesses remaining.
__________________
Check out my maps of the world in the ISDG Lexicography thread!
"[Columbus's conquests] can also be seen as a bloody atrocity...genocide and slavery." --James Loewen, Lies My Teacher Told Me
sapIkenak-atAbin inagalasIfi? (Can you speak Inagalasi?) If not, click here and learn how!
PTWDG Roleplay Team: The de la Civ Clan, currently Roberto Menor (in Pamplona) and Caterina Ordonez (in Pamplona). Also: George Finkle, born in the barbarian regions of southern Espana, and Leading S.P.I.N. Correspondent to Espana and the Vatican.


Posted by Rasputin on 08-12-2005 16:52:

Bumpy
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Posted by Ljube on 08-12-2005 18:29:

humpy
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Posted by Ljube on 08-12-2005 18:34:

The combined efforts to reduce my total have led me to decide to recount all results. Still, one or two things require clarification, such as if Paddy received a point for his Sydney.
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Posted by snoopy369 on 08-12-2005 19:53:

* Points were generally allowed unless discounted by the rules at the time. IE, early words that would never count now were allowed.

* My spreadsheet would never overcount someone. It's impossible. Spike has 103, or more ... It could miss a word due to misspelling spike's name or something (although I used various methods to check, and indeed find instances of, misspellings of peoples' names) ... but it's not going to give him an extra point. That would not be reasonably possible - unless it miscounted a 'no-point' word as giving a point, but I checked the totals of 'no-point' words.
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Posted by joncha on 08-12-2005 20:03:

quote:
Originally posted by snoopy369
* Points were generally allowed unless discounted by the rules at the time. IE, early words that would never count now were allowed.


Indeed. Sydney (not to mention "Plus Ones" ffs) is valid and should garner a point.

quote:
* My spreadsheet would never overcount someone. It's impossible. Spike has 103, or more ... It could miss a word due to misspelling spike's name or something (although I used various methods to check, and indeed find instances of, misspellings of peoples' names) ... but it's not going to give him an extra point. That would not be reasonably possible - unless it miscounted a 'no-point' word as giving a point, but I checked the totals of 'no-point' words.


That remains to be seen.
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If Tehben spits eggs at you, jump on them and throw them back.

Eventis be Yarrr and woo ~ (mostly) error free for 5 days.


Posted by Ljube on 08-12-2005 20:05:

Snoopy, you started playing hangman later than I did. When I started playing, word setter points were counted, but it might not have been like that from the beginning. I'm asking joncha, the founder.
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Posted by snoopy369 on 08-12-2005 20:13:

I used Joncha's rules, explicitly, and worked with him to develop the spreadsheet. It indeed assumes setter points, which were not initially counted as I understand, but seem to have been retroactively granted; certainly my count is close enough, anyhow, to any given count to discount this possible reason, unless a single word or two were not counted (505 total points, as opposed to 504).
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Posted by snoopy369 on 08-12-2005 20:55:

Hmm. There was a single possibility that I was checking, and it turned out to cause a significant change.

It turns out that it wasn't properly handling (...)^Ljube (and one other instance of this).

Curnently being fixed.
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Posted by Rasputin on 08-12-2005 21:36:

and meanwhile a game is a foot....
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Posted by civman2000 on 09-12-2005 04:44:

Hangman XXIX: Enhanced Graphics Edition

1 guess remaining.
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Check out my maps of the world in the ISDG Lexicography thread!
"[Columbus's conquests] can also be seen as a bloody atrocity...genocide and slavery." --James Loewen, Lies My Teacher Told Me
sapIkenak-atAbin inagalasIfi? (Can you speak Inagalasi?) If not, click here and learn how!
PTWDG Roleplay Team: The de la Civ Clan, currently Roberto Menor (in Pamplona) and Caterina Ordonez (in Pamplona). Also: George Finkle, born in the barbarian regions of southern Espana, and Leading S.P.I.N. Correspondent to Espana and the Vatican.


Posted by DrSpike on 09-12-2005 10:37:

dumpy
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Posted by Jaguar on 09-12-2005 11:09:

Is it just me, or are a couple of words like gimpy possible, making this round of guessing ridiculously greedy?
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Posted by Nikolai on 09-12-2005 11:14:

It seems to be okay judging from dictionary.com. So, since there's no more to do except guessing words, or else we've lost, I guess it if it's okay for you. You didn't bold it, so I doubt it counts unfortunately. If you others think I should let Jaguar get the word if it's right, just say so. Gimpy
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Posted by DrSpike on 09-12-2005 11:18:

I couldn't see an -impy word that I thought wasn't slang.
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Posted by Nikolai on 09-12-2005 11:25:

Well, this is all that came up on gimpy:

[Origin unknown.]gimpy adj.

But as it didn't state it as slang, I thought it could be a permitted word.
__________________
Do not fear, for I am with you; Do not anxiously look about you, for I am your God. -Isaiah 41:10
The LORD your God is with you, he is mighty to save. He will take great delight in you, he will quiet you with his love, he will rejoice over you with singing. - Zephaniah 3:17
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Posted by joncha on 09-12-2005 11:32:

Gimp is listed as slang, therefore gimpy is also slang.
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Posted by Nikolai on 09-12-2005 11:39:

Okay. Then we know my contribution is void. But not that it matters anyhow, we don't have more guesses left... Let's hope for Spikie then...*goosebumps*
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Do not fear, for I am with you; Do not anxiously look about you, for I am your God. -Isaiah 41:10
The LORD your God is with you, he is mighty to save. He will take great delight in you, he will quiet you with his love, he will rejoice over you with singing. - Zephaniah 3:17
Get The List for cIV here!


Posted by Nikolai on 09-12-2005 11:42:

Not that I can guess anymore, but what about

dampy

\Damp"y\, a. 1. Somewhat damp. [Obs.] --Drayton.

2. Dejected; gloomy; sorrowful. [Obs.] ``Dispel dampy throughts.'' --Haywards.

?

I don't know what the obs and such means, but it's not wirtten slang anywhere either here or under damp.
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The LORD your God is with you, he is mighty to save. He will take great delight in you, he will quiet you with his love, he will rejoice over you with singing. - Zephaniah 3:17
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Posted by DrSpike on 09-12-2005 11:45:

A is gone.
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Posted by Nikolai on 09-12-2005 11:48:

Oh, my dumbass! I forgot that...
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Do not fear, for I am with you; Do not anxiously look about you, for I am your God. -Isaiah 41:10
The LORD your God is with you, he is mighty to save. He will take great delight in you, he will quiet you with his love, he will rejoice over you with singing. - Zephaniah 3:17
Get The List for cIV here!


Posted by civman2000 on 09-12-2005 15:14:

Hangman XXIX: Enhanced Graphics Edition

If only someone had been unselfish enough to guess U...
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Check out my maps of the world in the ISDG Lexicography thread!
"[Columbus's conquests] can also be seen as a bloody atrocity...genocide and slavery." --James Loewen, Lies My Teacher Told Me
sapIkenak-atAbin inagalasIfi? (Can you speak Inagalasi?) If not, click here and learn how!
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Posted by civman2000 on 09-12-2005 15:17:

Hmmm...looking it up one of the two entries at dictionary.com calls it slang. Never even occurred to me that it might be slang when I chose it; seems like a perfectly ordinary word to me...
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Check out my maps of the world in the ISDG Lexicography thread!
"[Columbus's conquests] can also be seen as a bloody atrocity...genocide and slavery." --James Loewen, Lies My Teacher Told Me
sapIkenak-atAbin inagalasIfi? (Can you speak Inagalasi?) If not, click here and learn how!
PTWDG Roleplay Team: The de la Civ Clan, currently Roberto Menor (in Pamplona) and Caterina Ordonez (in Pamplona). Also: George Finkle, born in the barbarian regions of southern Espana, and Leading S.P.I.N. Correspondent to Espana and the Vatican.


Posted by joncha on 09-12-2005 15:25:

It is a perfectly ordinary word, but it's also slang. The floor is open to a new word setter.
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Posted by Jaguar on 09-12-2005 15:29:

_ _ _ _ _ _

Six letters, 10 guesses
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Given his excellent SIG, I will say that this Jaguar is a man who has wisdom. - Philosophiser


Posted by DrSpike on 09-12-2005 15:30:

Damn, thought I had it.

Someone who doesn't have many points go for it.
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Posted by joncha on 09-12-2005 15:37:

A
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Posted by Zopperoni on 09-12-2005 17:09:

E
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Posted by Jaguar on 09-12-2005 17:15:

_ E _ _ _ _

A, 9 remaining
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Supporting the 13-2 Indianapolis Colts
Eschewing silly games since December 4, 2005
The KING OF THE JEWS became the SCOURGE OF THE JEWS, and the SCOURGE OF THE GENTILES, became the KING OF THE GENTILES!~ YES! All by the Cross! "His Blood Be Upon Us and On Our Children! Screamed the Jewry!" - Philosophiser
Given his excellent SIG, I will say that this Jaguar is a man who has wisdom. - Philosophiser


Posted by Nikolai on 10-12-2005 01:40:

Y
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Posted by Ljube on 10-12-2005 03:10:

Which word was that? I can't see images.

S
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Posted by DrSpike on 10-12-2005 03:12:

It was wimpy, which is slang. As you can see Jaguar has set the next word.
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Posted by Ljube on 10-12-2005 03:15:

Indeed, wimp only appears in American films spoken by mafia (excuse me - outfit) members, so it's definitely slang.
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Posted by Jaguar on 10-12-2005 09:19:

_ E _ _ _ Y

A, S
8 remaining
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Posted by Nikolai on 10-12-2005 09:26:

I knew it!
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Posted by DrSpike on 10-12-2005 09:58:

L
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Posted by joncha on 10-12-2005 12:28:

R
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Posted by Jaguar on 10-12-2005 13:25:

L E _ _ L Y

A, S, R
7 remaining
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The KING OF THE JEWS became the SCOURGE OF THE JEWS, and the SCOURGE OF THE GENTILES, became the KING OF THE GENTILES!~ YES! All by the Cross! "His Blood Be Upon Us and On Our Children! Screamed the Jewry!" - Philosophiser
Given his excellent SIG, I will say that this Jaguar is a man who has wisdom. - Philosophiser


Posted by joncha on 10-12-2005 13:26:

LEWDLY
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Posted by Jaguar on 10-12-2005 13:26:


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Supporting the 13-2 Indianapolis Colts
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The KING OF THE JEWS became the SCOURGE OF THE JEWS, and the SCOURGE OF THE GENTILES, became the KING OF THE GENTILES!~ YES! All by the Cross! "His Blood Be Upon Us and On Our Children! Screamed the Jewry!" - Philosophiser
Given his excellent SIG, I will say that this Jaguar is a man who has wisdom. - Philosophiser


Posted by joncha on 10-12-2005 13:43:

_ _ _ _ _

5 letters
10 guesses remaining
incorrect: ...
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Posted by Nikolai on 10-12-2005 14:12:

Y
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Posted by Rasputin on 10-12-2005 14:27:

R
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Posted by joncha on 10-12-2005 14:41:

_ R _ _ _

5 letters
9 guesses remaining
incorrect: Y
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Posted by Ljube on 10-12-2005 14:45:

N
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Posted by Ljube on 10-12-2005 16:26:

After an exhaustive recount double-checked by another recount using a different method, here are the final results:


I have 42 points, not 43.
Paddy has 35 points, not 34.
Duke has 30 points, not 29.
Theben has 16 points, not 15.
Rasputin has 4 points, not 5.


The rest of the tally is OK.
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Posted by Ljube on 10-12-2005 16:46:

For those interested I can post the spreadsheet which aided me in my recounts. The methods I employed are:

Preparatory activities for both recounts:
I copied the list of words and pasted it to one column of an excel spreadsheet. Next, I went through the cells and removed all words and all dashes leaving only names and various symbols (..., ...*, ...^(name)). Here I used two methods to make sure my recount was right.

1) I copied the column containing only names and special symbols to another column. Then I sorted the column alphabetically. This assured all names would be grouped. For each name I assigned a corresponding number (Zopperoni got number 1, alva got number 36). Then I filled the column next to the sorted column containing names with the corresponding numbers. This was simply a device to help me in my counting of the total for each player. These totals represented the points for word guessers. After these points were tallied, I returned to the original, unsorted column and manually counted the word setter points.

2) Having done all this, I proceeded to the second recount. I copied the first column to the third column and now, instead of sorting it, I went through the column and replaced each occurrence of the symbol ... with the name appearing in the list previously to the symbol, each occurrence of name* with an empty space and each occurrence of ...(name)^ with name. Then I sorted the list and applied the same helping device used in the first method (different numbers assigned to different names). The list so prepared would tally both word setter and word guesser points. When I compared the two tallies, they matched
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Posted by joncha on 10-12-2005 17:19:

I'm fine with accepting that as the official count. Please do post the spreadsheet, though.
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Posted by Jaguar on 10-12-2005 21:34:

U
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Eschewing silly games since December 4, 2005
The KING OF THE JEWS became the SCOURGE OF THE JEWS, and the SCOURGE OF THE GENTILES, became the KING OF THE GENTILES!~ YES! All by the Cross! "His Blood Be Upon Us and On Our Children! Screamed the Jewry!" - Philosophiser
Given his excellent SIG, I will say that this Jaguar is a man who has wisdom. - Philosophiser


Posted by joncha on 10-12-2005 21:35:

_ R _ _ N

5 letters
8 guesses remaining
incorrect: Y, U
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Posted by Ljube on 10-12-2005 21:44:

Here is my spreadsheet.
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Posted by Rasputin on 11-12-2005 00:56:

A
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Posted by snoopy369 on 11-12-2005 01:17:

O
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Posted by joncha on 11-12-2005 12:32:

_ R O _ N

5 letters
7 guesses remaining
incorrect: Y, U, A
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Posted by Jaguar on 11-12-2005 12:33:

FROWN
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Eschewing silly games since December 4, 2005
The KING OF THE JEWS became the SCOURGE OF THE JEWS, and the SCOURGE OF THE GENTILES, became the KING OF THE GENTILES!~ YES! All by the Cross! "His Blood Be Upon Us and On Our Children! Screamed the Jewry!" - Philosophiser
Given his excellent SIG, I will say that this Jaguar is a man who has wisdom. - Philosophiser


Posted by joncha on 11-12-2005 12:34:

_ R O _ N

5 letters
6 guesses remaining
incorrect: Y, U, A, FROWN
eliminated: Jaguar
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Posted by DrSpike on 11-12-2005 12:36:

I realise I have little chance, but:

brown
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Posted by joncha on 11-12-2005 12:40:

Your word.
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Posted by DrSpike on 11-12-2005 12:40:

Btw (and I know I'm going to get stick for this, but I'm going to say it anyway) I think it is highly against the spirit of the game for 2 players to warn each other (either by PM or on another site) that they are about to update, so they can share the words between them. Yes (as I'm sure I'm about to be told) there is no rule against it, but it's clearly not fair to the playerbase.

You know who you are - I've been watching this happen for a while now. Please don't deny it or make lame excuses.......if you think the practice is acceptable just argue your case.
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Posted by DrSpike on 11-12-2005 12:41:

quote:
Originally posted by joncha
Your word.


Wow, with so many possibilities (albeit not so many that it was greedy! ).

Anyway.

_ _ _ _ _
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Posted by joncha on 11-12-2005 12:48:

quote:
Originally posted by DrSpike
Btw (and I know I'm going to get stick for this, but I'm going to say it anyway) I think it is highly against the spirit of the game for 2 players to warn each other (either by PM or on another site) that they are about to update, so they can share the words between them. Yes (as I'm sure I'm about to be told) there is no rule against it, but it's clearly not fair to the playerbase.

You know who you are - I've been watching this happen for a while now. Please don't deny it or make lame excuses.......if you think the practice is acceptable just argue your case.


Some of us chat on MSN all the time. It isn't a matter of "warning" each other, but of all of us (myself, Ljube, snoopy, Jaguar and others) being aware of what is going on. In my experience (I can't speak for the others), it is someone who isn't the word setter reminding the setter that it's time to do an update. I'd say there is absolutely nothing against the spirit of the game in that. In fact, it's not updating when possible that goes against the spirit of the rules.
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Posted by Jaguar on 11-12-2005 12:49:

We, unlike you, update as soon as possible, which means that we, unlike you, move the game quickly when we're word-setters.

U
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The KING OF THE JEWS became the SCOURGE OF THE JEWS, and the SCOURGE OF THE GENTILES, became the KING OF THE GENTILES!~ YES! All by the Cross! "His Blood Be Upon Us and On Our Children! Screamed the Jewry!" - Philosophiser
Given his excellent SIG, I will say that this Jaguar is a man who has wisdom. - Philosophiser


Posted by joncha on 11-12-2005 12:50:

O
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Posted by duke o' york on 11-12-2005 12:51:

Y

Bugger. Since Y wasn't guessed in the first round, then I bet it's in the word.
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Posted by DrSpike on 11-12-2005 12:59:

Hehe yes, I knew you would both say this.

It is clearly, well, somewhat shady, for a group of players to know *nudge nudge wink wink* when the updates are going to occur. And it's clearly working. Looking back over the last few threads I'm impressed at the efficiency of your strategy so far. If you'd just do it a bit more (perhaps 'share' a few possible words you might use as well - nothing wrong with that as it's just speculative) you could take over the lead much faster. In many ways it would be a relief, and I actually am perverse enough to enjoy watching how far you will go to take it.
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Posted by DrSpike on 11-12-2005 13:00:

_ _ _ _ _

Used: u o

8 guesses remaining
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Posted by duke o' york on 11-12-2005 13:02:

Y
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Posted by joncha on 11-12-2005 13:16:

quote:
Originally posted by DrSpike
Hehe yes, I knew you would both say this.

It is clearly, well, somewhat shady, for a group of players to know *nudge nudge wink wink* when the updates are going to occur. And it's clearly working. Looking back over the last few threads I'm impressed at the efficiency of your strategy so far. If you'd just do it a bit more (perhaps 'share' a few possible words you might use as well - nothing wrong with that as it's just speculative) you could take over the lead much faster. In many ways it would be a relief, and I actually am perverse enough to enjoy watching how far you will go to take it.


Many of my updates happen immediately after the second guess because, unlike some players I could mention, I am not an ******* who likes to needlessly drag out the game. People know that, and remind me when it's time to update because, again unlike certain others, they know I will post one promptly.

As for the rest of the crap in your post, I can only assume it is a reflection on your own poor sportsmanship.
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Posted by DrSpike on 11-12-2005 13:26:

Hehe, if the smileys were working you probably could have told I'm pulling your leg a little. Plus I was trying to make a serious point about when giving your friends a little push becomes bad sportsmanship. After all, there's no rule against me telling Ljube the word. It's clearly against the spirit of the game though.

I do think what you do is a little more than just updating fast - if you'll look back over the threads you'll see many instances where you don't post for a few hours, then post, and bang, 1 second later Jaguar gets the word. And then vice versa, and the word remains in the hands of da brotherhood.

Come on, you never once had a let's get Spike conversation? You know you did.

Overall I think it's shady, but not enough to mention it again after this post. I know for a fact I can't stop you taking over, with a little help, and am honestly resigned to this. If it's not this it will be something else, so (at least from my end) there's no real point arguing.
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Posted by joncha on 11-12-2005 13:39:

Alright, then. But there better be smilies in your posts when they come online again.

If you checked further, you'd see I have had back-and-forth update/guesses with several players, most of whom you would never think of accusing of such things. There are a lot of people who take hangman very seriously, and are ready to pounce on a word as soon as an update appears. This is what has frustrated so many who see you online but see no update - they are ready to pounce!

And for the record, I need noone's help to overtake you.
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Posted by Rasputin on 11-12-2005 15:18:

man oh man, i rember when this hangman game was fun and just done to pass some time.

I was worried when i saw all the Spreadsheets and statistics being compiled and now this last little banter shows just how damn stupid this whole thing has become.

People are actualyl accusing people of cohorting to make sure certain people get past Drspikes number. This is pathetic, not even my 6 year old would think that this should become a competetion of any sorts.

This is not an inteligence challenge , the people who hav ethe highest scores here are simply the people who are online at the correct time most of the time. This is a game of luck mostly. So those thinking that by getting the most point you have achiueved something of reknown, forget it, it is just a mark of how much time you spend on poly and how lucky you are. Rarely are the words posted here difficult to get. I thought in relaity the only reason we al lplay this is to get +1s. WE can post lots of guesses even if we know the word and get more +1s

Lets forget about the point chasing and lets play for fun and not boasting rights, we are not immature little brats..... Or are WE ...
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Posted by DrSpike on 11-12-2005 15:25:

Hehe we made Raz make a serious post. It really was worth 29 threads.
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Posted by Ljube on 11-12-2005 15:46:

P

This one is for Paddy.
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Posted by Ljube on 11-12-2005 16:22:

quote:
Originally posted by Ljube
After an exhaustive recount double-checked by another recount using a different method, here are the final results:


I have 42 points, not 43.
Paddy has 35 points, not 34.
Duke has 30 points, not 29.
Theben has 16 points, not 15.
Rasputin has 4 points, not 5.


The rest of the tally is OK.



Quoting myself, but what else can I do?

I think you should update the totals in accordance with these corrections joncha before one of the people involved gets a point.
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Posted by joncha on 11-12-2005 16:31:

I was waiting for someone else to chime in first.

The changes, as I understand it, are:

Ljube-ljcvetko -1
Paddy the scot +1
duke o' york +1
Theben +1
Rasputin -1
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Posted by Rasputin on 11-12-2005 16:31:

Now back to insanity !! Please.
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Posted by DrSpike on 12-12-2005 11:45:

_ _ _ _ Y

Used: u o p

7 guesses remaining
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Posted by joncha on 12-12-2005 12:03:

I
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Posted by duke o' york on 12-12-2005 12:14:

Did someone tell you he was going to update?


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Posted by Jaguar on 12-12-2005 12:15:

It would seem so.

C
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The KING OF THE JEWS became the SCOURGE OF THE JEWS, and the SCOURGE OF THE GENTILES, became the KING OF THE GENTILES!~ YES! All by the Cross! "His Blood Be Upon Us and On Our Children! Screamed the Jewry!" - Philosophiser
Given his excellent SIG, I will say that this Jaguar is a man who has wisdom. - Philosophiser


Posted by joncha on 12-12-2005 12:28:

I admit it! Spike and I are in cahoots! All the sniping back and forth is just a cover for our nefarious schemes!
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Posted by Rasputin on 12-12-2005 14:05:

yes yes we know you lsecretly love each other.. now get on with the game
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Posted by Chaunk on 12-12-2005 14:15:

secretly????





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Posted by Rasputin on 12-12-2005 14:23:

they havent come out of the closet fully yet...
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Posted by DrSpike on 13-12-2005 10:52:

quote:
Originally posted by duke o' york
Did someone tell you he was going to update?



Hehe it was 18 minutes not 18 seconds.
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Posted by DrSpike on 13-12-2005 10:53:

_ _ _ _ Y

Used: u o p i c

5 guesses remaining
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Posted by duke o' york on 13-12-2005 11:00:

A
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Posted by Chaunk on 13-12-2005 11:17:

E
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Posted by Hercules on 13-12-2005 18:31:

That's all the vowels.


Posted by joncha on 13-12-2005 20:11:

Shocking, that.
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Posted by Rasputin on 13-12-2005 22:39:

no he always goes for words with low numbers of vowels..
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Posted by Jaguar on 13-12-2005 22:40:

And the one vowel in the word is quite often the last one guessed. Much more often than it should be, statistically.
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Given his excellent SIG, I will say that this Jaguar is a man who has wisdom. - Philosophiser


Posted by DrSpike on 14-12-2005 01:43:

_ A _ _ Y

Used: u o p i c e

4 guesses remaining

I would also like to invite Jaguar to elaborate on his assertion. I rarely use E for a start, and try and mix up the others, so that if people don't guess E they should get the vowel used correct on the 2nd or 3rd attempt.

Perhaps this is merely a response to my (correct it seems) guess that some players are coordinating updates.
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Posted by joncha on 14-12-2005 01:44:

B
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Posted by joncha on 14-12-2005 01:45:

ZOMFG 1 MINUTE IT MUST HAVE BEEN COORDINATED!!!11
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Posted by Jaguar on 14-12-2005 01:46:

F
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The KING OF THE JEWS became the SCOURGE OF THE JEWS, and the SCOURGE OF THE GENTILES, became the KING OF THE GENTILES!~ YES! All by the Cross! "His Blood Be Upon Us and On Our Children! Screamed the Jewry!" - Philosophiser
Given his excellent SIG, I will say that this Jaguar is a man who has wisdom. - Philosophiser


Posted by Jaguar on 14-12-2005 02:02:

quote:
Originally posted by DrSpike
_ A _ _ Y

Used: u o p i c e

4 guesses remaining

I would also like to invite Jaguar to elaborate on his assertion.

Certainly. Here are the vowel guesses from your words in the last three threads.

This time around, the first three vowel guesses were U, O, I, and then A and E simultaneously. It was an A word.

Last time, we guessed A, E, U before getting the correct vowel.

The word before that, we guessed U, E, I, O, and the word was gland. Five guesses.

Before that was the only time we've done as well as the statistical average, and gotten the vowel with our third guess. We guessed I, U, and it turned out to be an A word, but your time ran out.

With quack, it took us five guesses to get the vowel.

With Gully, it took us five guesses to get the vowel once again.

Continue going back, when you used the word Junky, the U was the fourth vowel guessed.

So in the past 7 words, it has taken us 4.5, 4, 5, 3, 5, 5, and 4 guesses. Remarkably the vowel is guessed, on average, in 4.4 guesses, when it should be guessed in three. I haven't postulated any reason for this anomaly, I've just noted its existence. I, unlike you, refrain from making accusations.
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The KING OF THE JEWS became the SCOURGE OF THE JEWS, and the SCOURGE OF THE GENTILES, became the KING OF THE GENTILES!~ YES! All by the Cross! "His Blood Be Upon Us and On Our Children! Screamed the Jewry!" - Philosophiser
Given his excellent SIG, I will say that this Jaguar is a man who has wisdom. - Philosophiser


Posted by Jaguar on 14-12-2005 02:17:

The trend actually continues further back as well. I've now researched it back to Hangman 22.

Spike has set 18 words since Hangman 22. 17 have had only one vowel. The words are followed by the number of guesses it took to get the vowel right. In the cases where two vowels were guessed simultaneously, I counted it half. For example, if vowels three and four are guessed simultaneously, and one is correct, then it is counted as 3.5 guesses.

If we exclude jived, because it has two vowels, and the word where the vowel wasn't guessed before Spike ran out of time, we are left with 16 words. In those sixteen words, the first two vowel guesses were never correct.

Humpy - 4.5
Biddy - 4
Boggy - 4.5
Muddy - 5
Dummy - 3.5
Jived - 3.5
Fuggy - 5
Jimmy - 3.5
Baggy - 5
***** - 5
Unknown word - at least 3
Junky - 4
Gully - 5
Quack - 5
Unknown word - 3
Gland - 5
Fizzy - 4
Word currently in play - 4.5


The chances of one of the first two vowel guesses being incorrect, assuming that players guess randomly, are 60%. There's a 4/5 chance of the players getting the vowel wrong on the first guess, and there's a 3/4 chance, following that, of them getting the second guess wrong. 4/5 x 3/4 = 3/5. 60% chance.

However, the chances of the first two guesses always being wrong for sixteen straight words (if we don't count the two I mentioned before) is .6 to the sixteenth power. (.6^16) There's a %0.028 chance of that happening, assuming random vowel guessing.

Our self-proclaimed Forum Games King is phenomenally lucky.
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The KING OF THE JEWS became the SCOURGE OF THE JEWS, and the SCOURGE OF THE GENTILES, became the KING OF THE GENTILES!~ YES! All by the Cross! "His Blood Be Upon Us and On Our Children! Screamed the Jewry!" - Philosophiser
Given his excellent SIG, I will say that this Jaguar is a man who has wisdom. - Philosophiser


Posted by Nikolai on 14-12-2005 03:07:

Guys, can't we just play and have fun?
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Posted by Jaguar on 14-12-2005 03:19:

Spike asked me to elaborate, and I did. I haven't been playing this game for as long as you have, but it hasn't taken me long to realize there's a somewhat poisonous atmosphere between some of the players. I noticed this trend when I first started playing, but I kept quiet about it because I don't like throwing accusations around.

I have no stake in this. I'm not in the top ten, although I'm approaching it quickly. But I think we do need a fair game, and I'm not so sure everyone's playing fairly right now.
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Posted by Nikolai on 14-12-2005 04:22:

I wasn't talking to you in particular. Yes, I've noticed there are some bad atmosphere here, and it's not nice to try to cheat. But honestly, this is a game, and a light one too, I prefer just playing it, and not have to read pages up and down with accusations and chickfights...

BTW, I haven't played this game that long either. I think I came into this some 10-12 threads ago at most.
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Posted by Chaunk on 14-12-2005 04:48:

quote:
Originally posted by Nikolai
Yes, I've noticed there are some bad atmosphere here, and it's not nice to try to cheat. But honestly, this is a game, and a light one too, I prefer just playing it, and not have to read pages up and down with accusations and chickfights...


QFT!
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Posted by duke o' york on 14-12-2005 07:31:

If anyone's cheating, please stop, and if anyone wants to accuse others of cheating please stop that too.

Oh, and an update would be nice.
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Posted by Nikolai on 14-12-2005 07:58:

Yeah, it's been more than six hours, surely the good ol' doc is known for not waiting much longer than that...
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Posted by DrSpike on 14-12-2005 17:02:

B A _ _ Y

Used: u o p i c e g

3 guesses remaining
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Posted by DrSpike on 14-12-2005 17:15:

quote:
Originally posted by Jaguar
Spike asked me to elaborate, and I did. I haven't been playing this game for as long as you have, but it hasn't taken me long to realize there's a somewhat poisonous atmosphere between some of the players. I noticed this trend when I first started playing, but I kept quiet about it because I don't like throwing accusations around.

I have no stake in this. I'm not in the top ten, although I'm approaching it quickly. But I think we do need a fair game, and I'm not so sure everyone's playing fairly right now.


I did ask you to elaborate, quite deliberately. You (or anyone) should not keep quiet if there are things you wish to say, like for instance your opinion that some players are not playing fairly. I would encourage all such opinions to be expressed and discussed, because if one person thinks it others will too, and I personally have no interest in leading in a game where there are doubts.

I think though, that you do have a stake, through your friendship with Joncha. Your analysis is interesting - I find myself wondering your thoughts on more direct evidence. To my knowledge direct evidence has only occurred once in the history of hangman, and it wasn't for one of my words.

Overall I agree with your assertion that not all players have played fairly at all times.
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Posted by Rasputin on 14-12-2005 18:05:

spikey plays this game to win, he doesnt set words that can be guessed quickly, he likes to be "leading" the pack. but in a game more luck than skill it doesnt really matter t o most here who leads....

so play on mcduff.....
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Posted by Jaguar on 14-12-2005 18:25:

quote:
Originally posted by DrSpike


I did ask you to elaborate, quite deliberately. You (or anyone) should not keep quiet if there are things you wish to say, like for instance your opinion that some players are not playing fairly. I would encourage all such opinions to be expressed and discussed, because if one person thinks it others will too, and I personally have no interest in leading in a game where there are doubts.

I think though, that you do have a stake, through your friendship with Joncha. Your analysis is interesting - I find myself wondering your thoughts on more direct evidence. To my knowledge direct evidence has only occurred once in the history of hangman, and it wasn't for one of my words.

Overall I agree with your assertion that not all players have played fairly at all times.

I don't have any direct evidence of anything. I just note your absolutely remarkable streak of luck.

Considering the atmosphere in this game recently, I wouldn't be surprised if there were people who hold their pride more sacred than their honour.

joncha's been catching up to you for a long time, and furthermore, your battle for first place doesn't mean nearly as much to anyone else as it does to the two of you. It's certainly not something worth sacrificing one's honor for.


edit: accidentally made a letter guess, even though I'm not allowed to do so.
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Posted by Rasputin on 14-12-2005 18:29:

D
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Posted by snoopy369 on 14-12-2005 20:58:

L
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Posted by snoopy369 on 14-12-2005 20:59:

I think I haven't won a word in way too long. Clearly there's cheating afoot

On another note, I save all of my words prior to posting in a location on poly that can be checked by admins if necessary to verify my words as valid and posted ahead of time.
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Posted by Rasputin on 14-12-2005 21:42:

I hope that isnt necessary , but with all the allegations flaoting around perhaps it is ...
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Posted by DrSpike on 15-12-2005 10:50:

I would support that idea if someone else organises it. Of course the coordination problems will still remain, but there is no way to effectively guard against those that like such things.
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Posted by duke o' york on 15-12-2005 10:57:

How about just posting your word in a passworded zip file at the time of posting it? Just like for the mafia coin tosses?
Even better, just post some stupid picture in the zip file, and use the hangman word as the password.
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Posted by DrSpike on 15-12-2005 10:57:

quote:
Originally posted by Jaguar

I don't have any direct evidence of anything. I just note your absolutely remarkable streak of luck.


Hehe yes you overlook what direct evidence we have because you don't like the conclusion.

I also wonder if my 'remarkable streak of luck' would continue if you analysed a larger sample size (I have done 100+ words you know! ) and dropped the E as I said before. I don't want to make more work for you but you are going to make implications you really should be thorough, I feel.

quote:
Originally posted by Jaguar

Considering the atmosphere in this game recently, I wouldn't be surprised if there were people who hold their pride more sacred than their honour.


I agree.

quote:
Originally posted by Jaguar
joncha's been catching up to you for a long time, and furthermore, your battle for first place doesn't mean nearly as much to anyone else as it does to the two of you. It's certainly not something worth sacrificing one's honor for.


Agreed and agreed.
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Posted by DrSpike on 15-12-2005 11:01:

quote:
Originally posted by duke o' york
How about just posting your word in a passworded zip file at the time of posting it? Just like for the mafia coin tosses?


We should vote on this proposal.

I vote in favour.
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Posted by duke o' york on 15-12-2005 11:02:

I propose an update. We all know you like to post here Spike, but since you're obviously here, and two guesses have been posted since the last update, then it would be unsporting not to.
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Posted by DrSpike on 15-12-2005 11:03:

I propose you stop posting so that I can get to it.

B A _ D Y

Used: u o p i c e g L

2 guesses remaining
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Posted by duke o' york on 15-12-2005 11:09:

W
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Posted by joncha on 15-12-2005 11:18:

Bandy, just in case.
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Posted by joncha on 15-12-2005 11:24:

quote:
Originally posted by DrSpike


We should vote on this proposal.

I vote in favour.


I support this, or selecting a referee.


Depending on how we want to do it, the referee could either be there just to receive the word at the start for verification or act as a GM and run the updates on behalf of the players. The latter would also reduce some of the other tension around here, I think. The only problem would be finding someone willing to do it that all sides would see as impartial. Perhaps we could elect them for 10 word terms, or thread by thread.
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Posted by Rasputin on 15-12-2005 13:49:

a GM would probalby work better, a PAssworded zip file could stil lbe changed.

Only a PM to a GM would be ample evidence.
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Posted by duke o' york on 15-12-2005 13:52:

How so? I didn't think you could edit an attachment out of your post, and then replace it with another. Besides, the edit message would still appear.
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Posted by Rasputin on 15-12-2005 14:04:

testing
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Posted by Rasputin on 15-12-2005 14:08:

so the sugestion is to uplaod a Zip file like above for esch word we post ??

providing none of us are Hackers with some sort of password remover we should be ok....
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Posted by DrSpike on 15-12-2005 14:33:

quote:
Originally posted by joncha


I support this, or selecting a referee.


Depending on how we want to do it, the referee could either be there just to receive the word at the start for verification or act as a GM and run the updates on behalf of the players. The latter would also reduce some of the other tension around here, I think. The only problem would be finding someone willing to do it that all sides would see as impartial. Perhaps we could elect them for 10 word terms, or thread by thread.


The referee for updating is a complete no-go, and the referee for verification just seems pointless. Why waste time on human verification when you can just post a passworded zipped file? The rule could be that if you can't supply a password that unzips the word you used then no point. All edited posts containing the passworded file also mean no point.
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Posted by DrSpike on 15-12-2005 14:34:

Btw, over to Duke.
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Posted by joncha on 15-12-2005 15:21:

Why is a GM a no-go? We've used them successfully for all the other forum games. Once you win, you send them your word and they run the updates for you. No muss, no fuss.

The problem I can see with zips using the correct word as the password is nothing prevents unscrupulous players from plugging in guesses until it opens. I guess just having the correct word inside on a text file and using a different password to open it would solve that one, though. Nevermind.
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Posted by Rasputin on 15-12-2005 15:29:

yes dont use the hangman word to password the file..
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Posted by snoopy369 on 15-12-2005 18:47:

I'd accept a referee, I suppose, simply to allow updates to happen more often - and allow both the referee and the OP to do updates, whomever gets to it first. Basically just making a second person involved in the game.

I'm not sure I'm willing to play a game of Hangman that is so serious we need to do passworded ZIP files, however. Frankly if you care so much about this stupid #@$ game to cheat, be my guest ... I hate having only one update a day, because it takes out the fun of playing, but I don't see how anyone over the age of 12 could possibly care about their point total in this game. I did the initial spreadsheet solely because I enjoy making spreadsheets for things ...
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Posted by Jaguar on 15-12-2005 19:01:

I propose we just don't cheat. Honor > hangman points. Most of us realize that.
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Posted by Ljube on 15-12-2005 20:14:

I'll use password protected zip file for my words from now on. I don't like the idea of a referee as then the referee would not be able to play.


However, bear in mind that we do want more players here and additional rules would possibly ruin the fun for some of the potential players, as well as for some of the vets.


As for jaguar's accusations, I don't understand what you're trying to prove here? Even if we ignored that word setting involves some thinking, the fact that the average number of incorrect guesses before the first vowel is guessed in words set by DrSpike is greater than the mathematical expectation of the same number proves absolutely nothing. You are trying to draw conclusions from a very small number of examples using the calculus that is suited for the situations involving a very large number of examples. Or in other words: You can toss a coin 100 times and get heads each time. The probability for tails will remain 50% and your 100 trials will still have proved nothing as the following million flips might fall exactly 499950 heads and 500050 tails.

And quack was my word, not Spike's.
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Posted by Ljube on 15-12-2005 21:41:

On the second thought, I won't use password protected zip files. It's just time consuming and making up passwords might prove a hassle.
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Posted by joncha on 15-12-2005 22:22:

While we chew over the latest Hangman crisis, I'll update the standings to include these changes:

quote:
Originally posted by joncha
Ljube-ljcvetko -1
Paddy the scot +1
duke o' york +1
Theben +1
Rasputin -1

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Posted by Jaguar on 16-12-2005 04:29:

quote:
Originally posted by Ljube
I'll use password protected zip file for my words from now on. I don't like the idea of a referee as then the referee would not be able to play.


However, bear in mind that we do want more players here and additional rules would possibly ruin the fun for some of the potential players, as well as for some of the vets.


As for jaguar's accusations, I don't understand what you're trying to prove here? Even if we ignored that word setting involves some thinking, the fact that the average number of incorrect guesses before the first vowel is guessed in words set by DrSpike is greater than the mathematical expectation of the same number proves absolutely nothing. You are trying to draw conclusions from a very small number of examples using the calculus that is suited for the situations involving a very large number of examples. Or in other words: You can toss a coin 100 times and get heads each time. The probability for tails will remain 50% and your 100 trials will still have proved nothing as the following million flips might fall exactly 499950 heads and 500050 tails.

And quack was my word, not Spike's.

It's enough to prove quite definitively that there's something wrong here. Every first guess is wrong, and every second guess is wrong, for 18 straight words.

My point is that we don't just have fewer correct first guesses than the mean. We don't have any correct guesses at all.

A coin that flips heads 8 times in 10 tries isn't necessarily loaded. One that flips heads 800 times in 1000 is. But one that flips heads 20 times in 20 tries is probably loaded, even with the small sample size.
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Given his excellent SIG, I will say that this Jaguar is a man who has wisdom. - Philosophiser


Posted by Nikolai on 16-12-2005 11:03:

It's now been ~21 hours since DrSpike gave Duke the word. That should mean the floor is open pretty soon...
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Posted by joncha on 16-12-2005 11:39:

Yes. Mr. o' york has less than 3 hours.
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Posted by Ljube on 16-12-2005 11:52:

The events are independent jag. And you can, of course, define a different event, like you did, that will have a very low probability of occuring, but that will only be your interpretation of the results so far.
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Posted by Jaguar on 16-12-2005 12:16:

My calculations are fine. Ever since Spike went to the 5-letter pattern in Hangman 23, the first two letter guesses have been wrong.

If a coin is flipped once, the probability of heads is 1/2. If a coin is flipped n times, the probability of heads every time is (1/2)^n.

This follows the same logic. In a single word, the probability of missing the first two vowel guesses is (3/5). The probability of missing those guesses n times is (3/5)^n.

Since Spike has set 17 words since he started exclusively using 5-letter words, the probability of us getting those guesses wrong every time is a one in several thousand chance. Spike says he sets words fairly, but the immutable laws of statistics tell me he doesn't. And between his word and probability, I'm afraid I'm inclined to go with probability.
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Given his excellent SIG, I will say that this Jaguar is a man who has wisdom. - Philosophiser


Posted by Ljube on 16-12-2005 12:36:

quote:
Originally posted by Jaguar
If a coin is flipped once, the probability of heads is 1/2. If a coin is flipped n times, the probability of heads every time is (1/2)^n.



Yes jag, the probability of heads every time is (1/2)^n. But this cannot lead to any conclusion as to whether the coin is rigged or not because each flip is independent and streaks like that can happen.

The probability of heads each time is still 1/2.
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Posted by Ljube on 16-12-2005 12:38:

quote:
Originally posted by Jaguar
Since Spike has set 17 words since he started exclusively using 5-letter words, the probability of us getting those guesses wrong every time is a one in several thousand chance. Spike says he sets words fairly, but the immutable laws of statistics tell me he doesn't. And between his word and probability, I'm afraid I'm inclined to go with probability.



Laws of statistics are not applicable to a sample of only 17 words.
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Posted by DrSpike on 16-12-2005 13:04:

And I already said do it for all my words and post the results (and do it fairly removing the E as I've said twice); I have nothing to hide.

And it seems Jaguar you have changed from merely noting a statistical result to making a flat out accusation. I still find it odd that you are willing to go to great lengths to prove some irregularity on my part but overlook the only person who has ever changed a word during a hangman game, simply because that person is your friend.
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Posted by DrSpike on 16-12-2005 13:14:

quote:
Originally posted by Jaguar
I propose we just don't cheat. Honor > hangman points. Most of us realize that.


I don't mind this approach or the passworded approach. But if you insist on making accusations (despite your earlier assertions that you were not) I prefer the password approach, for obvious reasons.
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Posted by DrSpike on 16-12-2005 13:29:

I've been reading back aways. It's actually a really nice system you guys have going. Jaguar attacks me whilst Joncha remains aloof and above the fray.

The one thing I really strongly agree with reading back is that this is all pretty stupid, and people could easily get discouraged from playing. I'm actually in a tough position though, because I have to respond to attacks.

If the group thinks there are strong doubts about outcomes we should just move to passworded zip files and end all discussion once and for all. If not, then let's carry on. My one request is that the coordinated update abuse is minimised. I am reasonable enough to realise that it will happen sometimes, but if those that engage in such practices truly think honour is more important than points they will at least keep their coordination down to reasonable levels.
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Posted by Jaguar on 16-12-2005 13:31:

quote:

Yes jag, the probability of heads every time is (1/2)^n. But this cannot lead to any conclusion as to whether the coin is rigged or not because each flip is independent and streaks like that can happen.

The probability of heads each time is still 1/2.

Laws of statistics are not applicable to a sample of only 17 words.

Statistical calculations do take sample size into account. The chi square test, for example, shows that a coin that flips heads 5 times out of 20 is not necessarily loaded, but a coin that flips heads 500 times out of 2000 definitely is. The probability of heads 5 times or fewer in 20 flips is 11.385%. The probability of heads 500 times or fewer in 2000 flips is 0. 00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00025968%. If you found a coin that achieved those results, it would then be reasonable to assume it is loaded.

The small sample size is a factor here, but the deviations are so ridiculously wild here that there is still a <1% chance of them happening.

It's a question of whether you think Spike has one in a thousand luck, or that something else is going on. I think it is more than reasonable to believe the latter.
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Given his excellent SIG, I will say that this Jaguar is a man who has wisdom. - Philosophiser


Posted by Jaguar on 16-12-2005 13:34:

quote:
Originally posted by DrSpike
I've been reading back aways. It's actually a really nice system you guys have going. Jaguar attacks me whilst Joncha remains aloof and above the fray.

I'm the one attacking you because I'm the one who realized you were cheating.
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The KING OF THE JEWS became the SCOURGE OF THE JEWS, and the SCOURGE OF THE GENTILES, became the KING OF THE GENTILES!~ YES! All by the Cross! "His Blood Be Upon Us and On Our Children! Screamed the Jewry!" - Philosophiser
Given his excellent SIG, I will say that this Jaguar is a man who has wisdom. - Philosophiser


Posted by DrSpike on 16-12-2005 13:43:

quote:
Originally posted by DrSpike
I still find it odd that you are willing to go to great lengths to prove some irregularity on my part but overlook the only person who has ever changed a word during a hangman game, simply because that person is your friend.

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Posted by Jaguar on 16-12-2005 13:45:

Why do you bring jon into this? Whether or not he changed the word (as I understand it he just updated incorrectly once, leaving out a letter) is completely unrelated to your cheating.
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Given his excellent SIG, I will say that this Jaguar is a man who has wisdom. - Philosophiser


Posted by DrSpike on 16-12-2005 13:53:

Well it is relevant because you continue your witchhunt against me even though we have far more direct evidence, which you choose to ignore when painting me as the face of evil and yourself as Joncha as 'honourable'.

Personally I think that that evidence (edit: which was far more than just leaving out a letter, as you well know) and the coordinated updating is far better evidence of cheating than your selected 17 data points when there are over 100 to use,and you unfairly include E guesses.
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Posted by duke o' york on 16-12-2005 13:55:

_ _ _ _ _ _

6
10
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Posted by DrSpike on 16-12-2005 13:57:

And to Joncha - I am sorry the way this conversation has gone. You did not explicitly throw the first punch in the cheating allegations (though I of course cannot say the extent of your role in Jaguar's attacks), and I did not wish to either. However, the way things have gone tonight with the suspicions being escalated to outright attacks I feel I have no choice but to voice my opinion on the earlier incident.
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Posted by DrSpike on 16-12-2005 14:00:

A
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Posted by snoopy369 on 16-12-2005 14:01:

A
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Posted by duke o' york on 16-12-2005 14:01:

By the way, if anyone downloads this before the game is over, then the setter should win the game. I'm not sure if this is possible, because others may try to hijack the game, but this ought to stop the 1337 H3XX0rs among us from spoiling the game.
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Posted by snoopy369 on 16-12-2005 14:02:

Doh! O then.
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Posted by snoopy369 on 16-12-2005 14:02:

quote:
Originally posted by duke o' york
By the way, if anyone downloads this before the game is over, then the setter should win the game. I'm not sure if this is possible, because others may try to hijack the game, but this ought to stop the 1337 H3XX0rs among us from spoiling the game.


No. Then Joncha could just have Jaguar download his .zip files
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Posted by duke o' york on 16-12-2005 14:03:

_ _ _ A _ _

6

9

O
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Posted by Ljube on 16-12-2005 14:03:

EDIT: never mind
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Posted by duke o' york on 16-12-2005 14:04:

quote:
Originally posted by snoopy369


No. Then Joncha could just have Jaguar download his .zip files


Maybe it's not such a good idea for me to have chosen the winning word as the password then. D'oh!
Any chance of an edit?
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Posted by Jaguar on 16-12-2005 14:04:

quote:
Originally posted by DrSpike
Well it is relevant because you continue your witchhunt against me even though we have far more direct evidence, which you choose to ignore when painting me as the face of evil and yourself as Joncha as 'honourable'.

Personally I think that that evidence (edit: which was far more than just leaving out a letter, as you well know) and the coordinated updating is far better evidence of cheating than your selected 17 data points when there are over 100 to use,and you unfairly include E guesses.


I'm not painting joncha as anything. He is neither a participant in nor a subject of this debate.

These aren't 17 selected data points. These are your last 17 words, and all of your words since you started using 5 letter words.

There are not over 100 words to use, because many of your points are from guessing, not word-setting. If I counted correctly using ctrl-f in Firefox, you have 69 word guess points and 34 word setter points.

I don't suggest that you've been cheating from the beginning. I think that this behavior began as the game started to get competitive.

You are quick to point to others, but that's not an issue here. It would be wiser for you to defend yourself, and you've done a poor job of it so far.
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Posted by snoopy369 on 16-12-2005 14:05:

quote:
Originally posted by DrSpike
I've been reading back aways. It's actually a really nice system you guys have going. Jaguar attacks me whilst Joncha remains aloof and above the fray.


I hope you're not implying anything about Joncha there. I'd read that as "Jaguar's 17 and Joncha's ... older". Youth tend to get annoyed about things that older people don't get annoyed about as easily, and to say things that are more inappropriate than an adult would be willing to say. (No offense intended to Jaguar here - it simply to me explains the differences in posting styles, and is certainly appropriate when applied to the me of 10 years ago compared to the me of today.)
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Posted by Jaguar on 16-12-2005 14:06:

I
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Posted by Ljube on 16-12-2005 14:06:

Baseless accusations should stop because they are poisoning the good spirit that has prevailed so far in this game.

T
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Posted by Jaguar on 16-12-2005 14:08:

My accusations aren't baseless.
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Posted by Ljube on 16-12-2005 14:10:

The intemperate youth speaking.
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Posted by Jaguar on 16-12-2005 14:10:

Oh, and for the record, I've never seen a thread where anyone allegedly changed a word. I've seen several incorrect updates, but they were assumed to be honest mistakes.
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Given his excellent SIG, I will say that this Jaguar is a man who has wisdom. - Philosophiser


Posted by Jaguar on 16-12-2005 14:12:

quote:
Originally posted by Ljube
The intemperate youth speaking.

I should call OzzyKP over here.

If that's really the best argument you can make, then perhaps it would be wiser to stay silent. At least it's better than displaying a total ignorance of probability, though.
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Given his excellent SIG, I will say that this Jaguar is a man who has wisdom. - Philosophiser


Posted by DrSpike on 16-12-2005 14:13:

quote:
Originally posted by Jaguar


I'm not painting joncha as anything. He is neither a participant in nor a subject of this debate.


It is relevant, because given the strength of your attacks based on the evidence we have I can only imagine what your attacks would look like if I had done what Joncha did. It smacks of double standards to me.

quote:
Originally posted by Jaguar
These aren't 17 selected data points. These are your last 17 words, and all of your words since you started using 5 letter words.

There are not over 100 words to use, because many of your points are from guessing, not word-setting. If I counted correctly using ctrl-f in Firefox, you have 69 word guess points and 34 word setter points.


Mea culpa, and of course there isn't 100 data points to use as you say. There are, however, apparently 34. Perhaps you already did your analysis for the larger sample and the results didn't match what you want to prove?
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Posted by DrSpike on 16-12-2005 14:14:

quote:
Originally posted by Jaguar
Oh, and for the record, I've never seen a thread where anyone allegedly changed a word. I've seen several incorrect updates, but they were assumed to be honest mistakes.


Well then you should do your research before calling others ignorant.
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Posted by duke o' york on 16-12-2005 14:17:

quote:
Originally posted by Jaguar
Oh, and for the record, I've never seen a thread where anyone allegedly changed a word. I've seen several incorrect updates, but they were assumed to be honest mistakes.


I've done that, but was drunk and forgot the word. again.

_ _ _ A _ _

6

7

TOI
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Posted by Jaguar on 16-12-2005 14:18:

quote:
Originally posted by DrSpike


It is relevant, because given the strength of your attacks based on the evidence we have I can only imagine what your attacks would look like if I had done what Joncha did. It smacks of double standards to me.



Mea culpa, and of course there isn't 100 data points to use as you say. There are, however, apparently 34. Perhaps you already did your analysis for the larger sample and the results didn't match what you want to prove?

I haven't analyzed any before Hangman 23, for a couple of reasons.

1. I'm almost certain that nobody cheated until Hangman became very competitive.
2. You weren't using a uniform 5-letter-one-vowel approach until then. Your 18th-to-last word had 8 letters.
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Given his excellent SIG, I will say that this Jaguar is a man who has wisdom. - Philosophiser


Posted by DrSpike on 16-12-2005 14:19:

quote:
Originally posted by snoopy369


I hope you're not implying anything about Joncha there. I'd read that as "Jaguar's 17 and Joncha's ... older". Youth tend to get annoyed about things that older people don't get annoyed about as easily, and to say things that are more inappropriate than an adult would be willing to say. (No offense intended to Jaguar here - it simply to me explains the differences in posting styles, and is certainly appropriate when applied to the me of 10 years ago compared to the me of today.)


I'm not sure what I am implying. I have had my differences with Joncha, but I do feel we would have been able to resolve any problems, perhaps even privately so as not to bore anyone else.

Of course, I do not know whether Joncha is supporting Jaguar in his recent attacks or not. Perhaps when he arrives he will tell us.
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Posted by DrSpike on 16-12-2005 14:20:

quote:
Originally posted by Jaguar

I haven't analyzed any before Hangman 23 because I have reason to believe the analysis would not support my agenda


Corrected.
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Posted by snoopy369 on 16-12-2005 14:22:

L
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Posted by Ljube on 16-12-2005 14:22:

quote:
Originally posted by DrSpike
Of course, I do not know whether Joncha is supporting Jaguar in his recent attacks or not.



I don't think joncha is supporting jaguar in his crusade.
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Posted by duke o' york on 16-12-2005 14:23:

For the record, joncha be Yarr and woo!
However, Spike also be pretty damned good too. I'd prefer it if this kind of intrigue had never happened. When I claimed that Spike only used Y when it hadn't been guessed in the first round I was only pissed off that none of us seemed able to guess his words. Hangman should be easy to those (all) of us with large enough vocabularies, but the proof here is that it isn't. Sometimes we win, sometimes we lose, and sometimes Spike or joncha posts the correct guess just before we were about to.
C'est la vie.....

[edit]For future record: snoopy guessed L.
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Posted by Jaguar on 16-12-2005 14:24:

quote:
Originally posted by DrSpike


Corrected.


It would neither support nor hurt my agenda. I don't think you were cheating then, so those words aren't relevant.

You've attempted to change the subject in myriad ways, but there is no way to contest the simple truth that for six straight threads, nobody has ever guessed your vowels right until two were eliminated, and that the odds of this happening by mere luck are less than one in a thousand.
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Given his excellent SIG, I will say that this Jaguar is a man who has wisdom. - Philosophiser


Posted by DrSpike on 16-12-2005 14:27:

N
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Posted by DrSpike on 16-12-2005 14:29:

quote:
Originally posted by Ljube



I don't think joncha is supporting jaguar in his crusade.


From Joncha's behaviour in the past I think you may be right. However, they are friends and now he is kind of backed into a corner to at least partially support him. It's a shame.
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Posted by duke o' york on 16-12-2005 14:29:

_ _ L A _ _

6

6

INTO
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Posted by snoopy369 on 16-12-2005 14:29:

Okay, we have 4 people chatting here. That means somebody's not guessed who needs to
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Posted by Ljube on 16-12-2005 14:31:

S
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Posted by Jaguar on 16-12-2005 14:31:

I'm eligible to guess now.

E


jon staying out of the thread is a prudent thing to do, given that he was catching up to Spike anyway, and he has too much stake in this to be deemed impartial anyway.
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Given his excellent SIG, I will say that this Jaguar is a man who has wisdom. - Philosophiser


Posted by snoopy369 on 16-12-2005 14:31:

Much better.

So, rather than chatting about DrSpike's low % of initial guesses being valid, how about chatting about the high % of my guesses that are valid
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Posted by Ljube on 16-12-2005 14:32:


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Posted by duke o' york on 16-12-2005 14:38:

Ljube's better than you snoopy.

S _ L A S _

TOE IN


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Posted by civman2000 on 16-12-2005 14:39:

SPLASH
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Posted by Jaguar on 16-12-2005 14:39:

SPLASH

edit: nice swoop, sir.
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Posted by DrSpike on 16-12-2005 14:41:

quote:
Originally posted by Jaguar


It would neither support nor hurt my agenda. I don't think you were cheating then, so those words aren't relevant.


Hmm yes, I could look at any one word on which I think person x was cheating and find evidence of it. Perhaps when person x turned around and said shut up you idiot, and prove it using all the data points I'd have to either do that or shut up as he or she requested.

I just looked at the earliest hangman thread I could find, number 7. By my quick count the first vowel is guessed quicker than average. There are several words set by me in that thread. So not only was I not cheating at this time I was actually reverse cheating to help out all the other players with their totals.

What a nice chap I am.
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Posted by duke o' york on 16-12-2005 14:42:



And the answer has been downloaded exactly 0 times. Honestly played everyone.

As I said, the password is the same as the word, so you can all check. But in future, don't use the same password as the word, or else people can download it and then check whether their answer is correct before guessing. If some moron wants to download the word then that's their problem, not ours.

[edit]Spike, be a good chap and boost my score by sending me all your words as you post them.
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Posted by Jaguar on 16-12-2005 14:44:

quote:
Originally posted by DrSpike


Hmm yes, I could look at any one word on which I think person x was cheating and find evidence of it. Perhaps when person x turned around and said shut up you idiot, and prove it using all the data points I'd have to either do that or shut up as he or she requested.

I just looked at the earliest hangman thread I could find, number 7. By my quick count the first vowel is guessed quicker than average. There are several words set by me in that thread. So not only was I not cheating at this time I was actually reverse cheating to help out all the other players with their totals.

What a nice chap I am.

A few correct first guesses are fine. More correct than average is fine. Less correct than average is fine.

A streak of seventeen straight wrong first guesses, and seventeen straight wrong second guesses, is not.
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Posted by civman2000 on 16-12-2005 14:47:

Hangman XXIX: Enhanced Graphics Edition

10 guesses remaining.
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Posted by Jaguar on 16-12-2005 14:47:

U

(same minute guess, obviously a coordinated update)
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Posted by civman2000 on 16-12-2005 14:50:

Hangman XXIX: Teh ZIPFILE!

I suppose I'm supposed to do this...
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Posted by DrSpike on 16-12-2005 14:53:

quote:
Originally posted by Jaguar

A few correct first guesses are fine. More correct than average is fine. Less correct than average is fine.

A streak of seventeen straight wrong first guesses, and seventeen straight wrong second guesses, is not.


I was using the extreme case of one word to make a point. You may not realise this but your method becomes more accurate as your sample size increases. At least that's what I used to tell my students when I taught statistics at university.

34 words is actually enough to invoke normality through the central limit theorem. But you probably already know this, and have probably already tried what I suggest.
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Posted by Ljube on 16-12-2005 14:53:

No, you are not supposed, but you can if you wish...

N
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Posted by DrSpike on 16-12-2005 14:57:

A
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Posted by snoopy369 on 16-12-2005 14:57:

Actually there's 2 pending letters before your A, sir.
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Posted by civman2000 on 16-12-2005 14:58:

Hangman XXIX: Enhanced Graphics Edition

9 guesses remaining.
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Posted by duke o' york on 16-12-2005 14:59:

R
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Posted by DrSpike on 16-12-2005 15:00:

quote:
Originally posted by snoopy369
Actually there's 2 pending letters before your A, sir.


Damn, caught again.
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Posted by Jaguar on 16-12-2005 15:00:

quote:
Originally posted by DrSpike


I was using the extreme case of one word to make a point. You may not realise this but your method becomes more accurate as your sample size increases. At least that's what I used to tell my students when I taught statistics at university.

If you've taught statistics, you know what a chi square test is. I get a chi squared value of 7, which is phenomenally high for one degree of freedom.

Why do you think this is?
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Posted by DrSpike on 16-12-2005 15:00:

T
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Posted by duke o' york on 16-12-2005 15:03:

Explain what chi squared is, and I might learn something from this thread rather than words with relatively (but not too ) obscure letters that I already know.

No-one has checked my zip, but the password was splash, and the word on the .doc file within was too.
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Posted by civman2000 on 16-12-2005 15:03:

Hangman XXIX: Enhanced Graphics Edition

8 guesses remaining.
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Posted by civman2000 on 16-12-2005 15:04:

Why on earth would you use a .doc instead of a simple text file?
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Posted by Jaguar on 16-12-2005 15:04:

H
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Given his excellent SIG, I will say that this Jaguar is a man who has wisdom. - Philosophiser


Posted by DrSpike on 16-12-2005 15:05:

quote:
Originally posted by Jaguar

If you've taught statistics, you know what a chi square test is. I get a chi squared value of 7, which is phenomenally high for one degree of freedom.

Why do you think this is?


I've told you, several times.

1) Treating each vowel as equal when they are not. Ljube also made this point.

2) Sample size. Depending on how you have calculated your chi-square it may not even be valid at all. With all 34 words I have done you could invoke normality and have a clearly distributed statistic for hypothesis tests.
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Posted by civman2000 on 16-12-2005 15:06:

Come on, how am I going to spell words with the incorrect letters if you people don't start incorrectly guessing some vowels?
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Posted by Ljube on 16-12-2005 15:09:

L
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Posted by Jaguar on 16-12-2005 15:10:

Spike, you used E once during that span, making it your least-used letter. However, I think E is not as common a first guess as the other vowels are against you. That should help us even further, but it doesn't.

I think my numbers are valid, and if you can prove that the aberration is statistically insignificant, then please do. If you can't, it won't be due to lack of knowledge about the subject.
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Given his excellent SIG, I will say that this Jaguar is a man who has wisdom. - Philosophiser


Posted by Jaguar on 16-12-2005 15:11:

quote:
Originally posted by civman2000
Come on, how am I going to spell words with the incorrect letters if you people don't start incorrectly guessing some vowels?

Well, you see, we got the vowel right on the first guess, so there's no need to.
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Given his excellent SIG, I will say that this Jaguar is a man who has wisdom. - Philosophiser


Posted by DrSpike on 16-12-2005 15:12:

quote:
Originally posted by duke o' york
Explain what chi squared is, and I might learn something from this thread rather than words with relatively (but not too ) obscure letters that I already know.


A chi square distribution is what you get when you square a normal distribution. The normal distribution is the familiar bell shaped curve. The chi square distribution is important for testing with random variables that are products of two normal distributions, and there are many practical statistical examples.

Not really wanting to get into a debate about asymptotic inference (which is essentially what it becomes) but in this case (in my expert opinion ) the approach I outlined is preferable the one chosen.
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Posted by civman2000 on 16-12-2005 15:13:

Hangman XXIX: Enhanced Graphics Edition

6 guesses remaining.
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Posted by duke o' york on 16-12-2005 15:15:

Y

quote:
Originally posted by civman2000
Why on earth would you use a .doc instead of a simple text file?


Because Word's easier to reach than notepad on my menu.
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Posted by Ljube on 16-12-2005 15:17:

Word documents are larger.
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Posted by DrSpike on 16-12-2005 15:17:

quote:
Originally posted by Jaguar
Spike, you used E once during that span, making it your least-used letter. However, I think E is not as common a first guess as the other vowels are against you. That should help us even further, but it doesn't.

I think my numbers are valid, and if you can prove that the aberration is statistically insignificant, then please do. If you can't, it won't be due to lack of knowledge about the subject.


Well I could of course carry out the procedure I outlined myself. I choose not to. It is you who has directly accused me of cheating in this thread, despite the fact there are problems with your method (as people other than myself have also pointed out). You were the one who chose to escalate your initial posts highlighting your statistical results into a direct accusation. If you feel that your results would stand up to a proper investigation then I suggest you follow your instincts.
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Posted by Jaguar on 16-12-2005 15:24:

I posted a very solid mathematical basis for my assertion immediately. The odds of getting the vowel wrong with the first guess are roughly four in five. The odds of getting the vowel wrong again are roughly three in four, meaning the odds of getting both wrong are roughly three in five.

The odds of getting both wrong seventeen times in a row are roughly .6^17. It's WAY under 1%. There's certainly a little wiggle-room, so to speak, but at best your string of "luck" is extremely improbable, bordering on miraculous.

That's all I have to say. If you have any decent counterargument, give it.
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Posted by duke o' york on 16-12-2005 15:27:

Gentlemen please.
Just mock me for using a .doc file in my .zip rather than a .txt. That ought to make you both feel better.
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Posted by DrSpike on 16-12-2005 15:30:

quote:
Originally posted by Jaguar
I posted a very solid mathematical basis for my assertion immediately. The odds of getting the vowel wrong with the first guess are roughly four in five. The odds of getting the vowel wrong again are roughly three in four, meaning the odds of getting both wrong are roughly three in five.

The odds of getting both wrong seventeen times in a row are roughly .6^17. It's WAY under 1%. There's certainly a little wiggle-room, so to speak, but at best your string of "luck" is extremely improbable, bordering on miraculous.

That's all I have to say. If you have any decent counterargument, give it.


Um, how about :

1) Treating each vowel as equal when they are not causes bias.

2) Sample size could be improved to see how robust the result is, and there is no reason I can see for not doing so other than you have secretly already tried it and found that your result disappears.
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Posted by DrSpike on 16-12-2005 15:32:

quote:
Originally posted by duke o' york
Gentlemen please.
Just mock me for using a .doc file in my .zip rather than a .txt. That ought to make you both feel better.


Noob.
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Posted by snoopy369 on 16-12-2005 15:39:

P
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Posted by Jaguar on 16-12-2005 15:42:

quote:
Originally posted by DrSpike


Um, how about :

1) Treating each vowel as equal when they are not causes bias.

2) Sample size could be improved to see how robust the result is, and there is no reason I can see for not doing so other than you have secretly already tried it and found that your result disappears.

Vowels are fairly equal. Especially since you, yourself, said that you try to use them equally with the exception of E, which you still occasionally use. My probability calculation is a rough estimate, but it is more than sufficient to show how unlikely the Spike Phenomenon is.

I've given the reasons for my sample selection repeatedly, and I don't think I need to give them again.
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Posted by civman2000 on 16-12-2005 15:43:

Hangman XXIX: Enhanced Graphics Edition

5 guesses remaining.
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Posted by Jaguar on 16-12-2005 15:43:

K
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Posted by duke o' york on 16-12-2005 15:44:

MURKY
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Posted by Jaguar on 16-12-2005 15:45:

Cheeky duke.
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Posted by Ljube on 16-12-2005 15:45:

curvy
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Posted by civman2000 on 16-12-2005 15:47:

Hangman XXIX: Enhanced Graphics Edition

The password was wimpyisnotslang.
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Posted by DrSpike on 16-12-2005 15:54:

quote:
Originally posted by Jaguar

Vowels are fairly equal. Especially since you, yourself, said that you try to use them equally with the exception of E, which you still occasionally use. My probability calculation is a rough estimate, but it is more than sufficient to show how unlikely the Spike Phenomenon is.

I've given the reasons for my sample selection repeatedly, and I don't think I need to give them again.


I wish you luck in your future studies if you are willing to interpret potentially hugely biased 'results' as close enough, particularly when you are using your 'results' to say something that, let's face it, is pretty nasty.

The least anyone should do before playing the cheat card is do sensitivity checks, examine their methodology, and make it as robust as possible.
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Posted by duke o' york on 16-12-2005 15:55:

_ _ _ _ _

5

10

[note to players - the word is not the password this time, but I am going to check the previous word. - and it be right. Yarr! ]
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Posted by DrSpike on 16-12-2005 15:55:

Re: Hangman XXIX: Enhanced Graphics Edition

quote:
Originally posted by civman2000
The password was wimpyisnotslang.



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Posted by Jaguar on 16-12-2005 16:02:

I was hoping that you would be man enough to face up to your dishonesty. I was wrong. There's no way I can prove that you cheated, but I've offered fairly evidence of extremely anomalous results over the past six threads, seven including this one.

This is as far as my argument can go. But there won't be further cheating of the sort I noted in hangman now, and that's probably the only thing that will be resolved.

I probably won't post any more on this subject.

O
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Posted by civman2000 on 16-12-2005 16:02:

Y
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Posted by Hercules on 16-12-2005 16:03:

Just too late there.


Posted by DrSpike on 16-12-2005 16:09:

quote:
Originally posted by Jaguar
I was hoping that you would be man enough to face up to your dishonesty. I was wrong. There's no way I can prove that you cheated, but I've offered fairly evidence of extremely anomalous results over the past six threads, seven including this one.

This is as far as my argument can go. But there won't be further cheating of the sort I noted in hangman now, and that's probably the only thing that will be resolved.

I probably won't post any more on this subject.





If I have cheated there are enough data points to prove it beyond reasonable doubt........you just don't want to try a proper analysis because it wont give you the results you want.

I was hoping you'd be man enough to admit that you were hasty in your accusations and that now you're backed into a corner you can't get out of. I'm not holding my breath.

Still, if it's true you are 17 then discretion and judgement are things you will pick up as you get older.

The one thing I agree on is posting on this subject. I'm going to bed now and I'd rather not drag this into the weekend. However, if attacked further I will have to respond. Plus, Joncha hasn't had chance to have his say yet.
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Posted by Ljube on 16-12-2005 16:12:

I bet joncha will ignore the debate.
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Posted by duke o' york on 16-12-2005 16:15:

Carp!

_ O _ _ Y

10


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Posted by DrSpike on 16-12-2005 16:16:

quote:
Originally posted by Ljube
I bet joncha will ignore the debate.


That would be pleasant but unexpected. Plus I don't think it would actually be fair on him not to get his views in.
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Posted by snoopy369 on 16-12-2005 16:16:

M
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Posted by Jaguar on 16-12-2005 16:33:

quote:
Originally posted by DrSpike


That would be pleasant but unexpected. Plus I don't think it would actually be fair on him not to get his views in.

It's exactly what I expect him to do.
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Given his excellent SIG, I will say that this Jaguar is a man who has wisdom. - Philosophiser


Posted by joncha on 16-12-2005 17:15:

Wow. I didn't realise I was such a popular guy.

Next time you schedule a debate, let me know ahead of time so I can take the day off work.

Also, B.
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Posted by snoopy369 on 16-12-2005 17:17:

Hey, I had the foresight to take the day off ahead of time (To watch the debate ... watching is way more fun that participating )
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Posted by DrSpike on 17-12-2005 03:23:

quote:
Originally posted by joncha
Next time you schedule a debate, let me know ahead of time so I can take the day off work.


Sorry, I didn't know either until I got in from work.
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Posted by duke o' york on 17-12-2005 04:33:

B O _ _ Y

9

M

Hmm, this is going all too well for you.
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Posted by civman2000 on 17-12-2005 04:42:

There are few enough possibilities to start guessing.

BOGEY
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Posted by DrSpike on 17-12-2005 04:50:

G
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Posted by duke o' york on 17-12-2005 05:19:

B O _ _ Y

7

GM

Bogey
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Posted by DrSpike on 17-12-2005 05:20:

bonny
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Posted by Ljube on 17-12-2005 05:56:

Duke, DrSpike's G guess was invalid and you should have ignored it. Since the rules say nothing about this, I suggest we establish a precedent that such guesses if incorrect will not count against the total of remaining guesses.
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Posted by duke o' york on 17-12-2005 06:05:

No, because then you will know not to guess G. Sorry.

Bonny is wrong too.

B O _ _ Y

6

GM

Bogey, bonny.
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Posted by Ljube on 17-12-2005 06:09:

Really? And how does counting an invalid guess help us? You can't arbitrarily count an invalid and also incorrect guess because that reduces our chances of winning and increases yours. Since counting G was entirely your fault, it should not affect adversely our chances of guessing your word correctly.
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Posted by duke o' york on 17-12-2005 06:12:

This is being played under duke rules (v 1.1) so accept that and just guess letters/words. I can't be bothered to play with your red tape so just enjoy the game. If you want to be really honest and sportsmanlike, then guess G.
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Posted by Ljube on 17-12-2005 06:13:

G
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Posted by Ljube on 17-12-2005 06:14:

Who knows, it may yet be there.
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Posted by DrSpike on 17-12-2005 07:47:

Oops.

Looking back I made the mistake in making a guess after the word guess (can never remember whether we finally added this rule or not) and Duke made the mistake of accepting it.
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Posted by snoopy369 on 17-12-2005 09:49:

S
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Posted by snoopy369 on 17-12-2005 09:50:

Spike, why'd you guess Bonny, anyway? N would have been just as good, and would have helped get the word...
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Posted by snoopy369 on 17-12-2005 09:50:

Oh, right, you sort of guessed a letter, nevermind.
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Posted by duke o' york on 17-12-2005 09:53:

B O _ _ Y

5

GSM

Bonny, Bogey
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Posted by joncha on 17-12-2005 12:40:

edit

Oops. Nothing here.
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Posted by DrSpike on 17-12-2005 12:49:

I admit my curiosity is piqued.
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Posted by duke o' york on 17-12-2005 12:51:

Mine too, and annoyed that I didn't get here in time. I bet he guessed bonny.


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Posted by joncha on 17-12-2005 12:53:

I clearly did not guess a word or letter that has already been eliminated. That would be stupid.

I will, however, refrain from guessing again on this word.
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Posted by Jaguar on 17-12-2005 12:59:

BOTHY
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Posted by duke o' york on 17-12-2005 13:16:



Password is monkeymonkey.
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Posted by Jaguar on 17-12-2005 14:10:

_ _ _ _ _

Five letters, ten guesses


Zip coming shortly.
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Posted by duke o' york on 17-12-2005 14:13:

E
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Posted by Jaguar on 17-12-2005 14:16:

Here's the zip.
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Given his excellent SIG, I will say that this Jaguar is a man who has wisdom. - Philosophiser


Posted by joncha on 17-12-2005 14:17:

A
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Posted by Jaguar on 17-12-2005 14:17:

_ _ _ E _

Nine guesses, A
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Given his excellent SIG, I will say that this Jaguar is a man who has wisdom. - Philosophiser


Posted by Nikolai on 17-12-2005 15:12:

Y
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Posted by Ljube on 17-12-2005 16:21:

D
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Posted by Jaguar on 17-12-2005 16:35:

_ _ _ E _

Seven guesses, A, Y, D
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Given his excellent SIG, I will say that this Jaguar is a man who has wisdom. - Philosophiser


Posted by joncha on 17-12-2005 16:36:

R
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Posted by civman2000 on 18-12-2005 04:39:

O
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Posted by Jaguar on 18-12-2005 06:39:

R _ _ E _

Six guesses, A, Y, D, O
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Given his excellent SIG, I will say that this Jaguar is a man who has wisdom. - Philosophiser


Posted by Nikolai on 18-12-2005 08:09:

I
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Posted by snoopy369 on 18-12-2005 09:57:

N
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Posted by Jaguar on 18-12-2005 10:40:

Nice pair of guesses there

R I _ E N

Six guesses, A, Y, D, O
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Posted by DrSpike on 18-12-2005 10:42:

V
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Posted by duke o' york on 18-12-2005 10:49:

S
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Posted by Jaguar on 18-12-2005 10:50:

Spike's word.
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Given his excellent SIG, I will say that this Jaguar is a man who has wisdom. - Philosophiser


Posted by snoopy369 on 18-12-2005 11:38:

Sigh, i thought it would be riven. Stupidly guessed N instead of just guessing a word
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Posted by DrSpike on 18-12-2005 14:14:

Well, guessing a word with just R _ _ E _ in it would have been a little hasty.

_ _ _ _ _

Zip coming shortly.
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Posted by Nikolai on 18-12-2005 14:15:

Y
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Posted by joncha on 18-12-2005 14:20:

Kind of defeats the point if guesses get in before the zip gets posted.
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Posted by DrSpike on 18-12-2005 14:22:

Well I will post the zip now (first time I've done a passworded one ) and if Nikolai wants to change his guess he can.
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Posted by civman2000 on 18-12-2005 14:23:

I
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Posted by DrSpike on 18-12-2005 14:24:

Btw we are all seemingly voluntarily providing zips, though the majority vote seemed to be against adding it to the rules.

Next word I do I will comply with whatever the rule in force is. Perhaps now that we have done it for a few rounds more will vote in favour.
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Posted by joncha on 18-12-2005 14:30:

I will be adding a zip when/if I post a new word, but I think it might be too much of a barrier to new players participating if we make it manditory.
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Posted by snoopy369 on 18-12-2005 14:32:

I will not be posting ZIPs regardless of anything.
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Posted by joncha on 18-12-2005 14:33:

That's just because you're a cheating cheater what likes to cheat.
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Posted by snoopy369 on 18-12-2005 14:33:

You can do an update now, btw
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Posted by Ljube on 18-12-2005 15:12:

quote:
Originally posted by snoopy369
I will not be posting ZIPs regardless of anything.


I second that. And no to zip rules as that will be a deterrent to new players.
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Posted by Nikolai on 18-12-2005 15:29:

quote:
Originally posted by snoopy369
I will not be posting ZIPs regardless of anything.


I don't think I'll post any zip either, if I ever get a new word that is. You better trust me.
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Posted by Rasputin on 18-12-2005 17:23:

unzip the keyboard and do an update...
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Posted by snoopy369 on 18-12-2005 17:39:

You can't imagine how tempting that is to me.
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Posted by Rasputin on 18-12-2005 17:47:

and al lyo hangmen , dont forget to start the docpile voting at Mafia #41
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Posted by snoopy369 on 18-12-2005 18:45:

Hey, if they didn't kylle me I'd vote
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Posted by Rasputin on 18-12-2005 21:26:

poor snooopy ....
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Posted by DrSpike on 19-12-2005 08:14:

_ I _ _ _

Used: Y

9 guesses remaining
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Posted by DrSpike on 19-12-2005 08:15:

Someone downloaded my zip.
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Posted by joncha on 19-12-2005 08:36:

Don't look at me.

M
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Posted by Ljube on 19-12-2005 09:01:

quote:
Originally posted by DrSpike
Someone downloaded my zip.



Stop posting zips and try to update qucklier. The culprit may not have enough time to crack your password if you hurry with your updates.


E
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Posted by DrSpike on 19-12-2005 14:22:

_ I _ E _

Used: Y M

8 guesses remaining
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Posted by Nikolai on 19-12-2005 14:23:

R
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Posted by duke o' york on 19-12-2005 14:41:

D
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Posted by Jaguar on 19-12-2005 15:50:

It took only one round with zips to stop the Spike Effect. I shall say nothing further.
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Posted by Ljube on 19-12-2005 16:06:

Hahaha, he used two vowels this time.
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Posted by Nikolai on 19-12-2005 16:18:

quote:
Originally posted by Ljube
Hahaha, he used two vowels this time.


And no Y.
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Posted by Rasputin on 19-12-2005 16:33:

hmmmm suspicious minds !!
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Posted by Paddy the Scot on 20-12-2005 05:23:

still one of the strangest games on this site
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Posted by Ljube on 20-12-2005 05:28:

Paddy, come and join the new mafia and galactic overlord!!
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Posted by DrSpike on 20-12-2005 10:31:

quote:
Originally posted by Jaguar
It took only one round with zips to stop the Spike Effect. I shall say nothing further.


FFS, there are at least 2 vowels in this word, which increases the chance of getting them by several times. And, what is more, they were guessed incredibly fast, much more so than you would expect on average. Perhaps I should accuse the vowel guessers of cheating? Nope, because that's just the way it goes. I'll add that I voluntarily posted the zip.

This debate was over on the weekend, where I explained why your method was inherently flawed, and whilst you stuck to your accusations you said nothing further would be said then too. That lasted about 3 days.

We have an option to end discussion, which can be added to the rules if the groups wants (though at present it seems it does not). If this crap continues then I'm just going to withdraw and set my total to 0. The only reason I don't do so now is I suspect that that outcome would actually suit you.

You really need to grow up and learn some restraint and judgement. Being 17 is no excuse - there are lots of 17 year olds here who don't go around making what are rather nasty accusations. If I have to make one more post like this in this thread it will be my last.

I'll update later when less annoyed.
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Posted by Jaguar on 20-12-2005 11:18:

- - -
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Posted by duke o' york on 20-12-2005 11:35:

Gentlemen, please! Either go the pistols or swords route, or stop bickering altogether.
I'm sure that if this continues any longer then rah will have no choice but to close the thread and declare Hangman off-limits for 'poly. If the game matters to you both so much that you will argue over it, then its disappearance will matter a hell of a lot more.
Personal attacks are also not allowed here, so some judicious editing of the two prior posts might be in order if you aren't to be forced into 'poly cold turkey.
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Posted by Jaguar on 20-12-2005 11:44:

The game matters to me, the score doesn't.

Post removed.
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Posted by Nikolai on 20-12-2005 12:22:

This is beginning to tire me, perhaps it wouldn't be too bad if the game was shut down after all. Then we'd at least be free of all these accusations and chickfights all the time...
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Posted by joncha on 20-12-2005 12:24:

Thanks Nikolai. Way to help keep the game alive.
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Posted by Nikolai on 20-12-2005 12:33:

I'm with if you guys start to behave like grown ups.
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Posted by joncha on 20-12-2005 12:59:

Let's just get on with the game.

Spike, you have an hour and forty minutes to become less annoyed.
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Posted by rah on 20-12-2005 13:00:

More examples why I should close the game down or move it to the OT. If you're going to act like it's the OT...........
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Posted by DrSpike on 20-12-2005 13:39:

_ I _ E D

Used: Y M R

7 guesses remaining
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Posted by Jaguar on 20-12-2005 13:43:

L
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Posted by joncha on 20-12-2005 13:45:

W
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Posted by DrSpike on 20-12-2005 13:48:

quote:
Originally posted by rah
More examples why I should close the game down or move it to the OT. If you're going to act like it's the OT...........


There's a time when I would have argued.........said that mafia was spammier and hangman had more game in it......that lots of players have put lots of effort into making hangman a good forum game.

However, given recent events I do think it would be more suited to OT. All the efforts made by many players amount to nothing if one can bring it all down by resorting to personal attacks.

I know votes don't count for much, but just in case they do the leading player in the scores says move any thread that follows this one to OT.

In fact, several have opined it should be moved, and an overwhelming majority support that if shutting down was the other option. You've never wanted it here Rah. Now's a good chance.
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Posted by duke o' york on 20-12-2005 13:52:

3.142/10

Are you allowed words in the past tense? Surely that's the same as having plurals. Never mind, maybe one for the next update. If you're not, then BIPED.
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Posted by joncha on 20-12-2005 13:52:

Moving it to the OT will kill the game. Just give me a 100% pcr and leave Hangman here.

I will leave alone the point that the person who started the personal attacks is the one complaining about them the most.
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Posted by joncha on 20-12-2005 13:54:

That was an exceedingly greedy guess, duke. You could have at least waited for the update.
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Posted by duke o' york on 20-12-2005 13:56:

No, I think that words in the past tense aren't allowed - that's the same as plurals really, and it's the first word I thought of that isn't a plural but fits.
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Posted by joncha on 20-12-2005 13:57:

Except that they are allowed.

There have got to be about 50 words that fit, maybe half that after the update.
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Posted by DrSpike on 20-12-2005 13:59:

quote:
Originally posted by Nikolai
This is beginning to tire me, perhaps it wouldn't be too bad if the game was shut down after all. Then we'd at least be free of all these accusations and chickfights all the time...


I hear you and sympathise, I really do. But there is no way to win in my position. I can be quiet, and therefore let the attacks be made despite the shaky ground on which they are founded, or I can respond. Either way I lose.
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Posted by joncha on 20-12-2005 14:00:

Gosh. Exactly the same position you put me in earlier.
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Posted by DrSpike on 20-12-2005 14:01:

quote:
Originally posted by joncha
I will leave alone the point that the person who started the personal attacks is the one complaining about them the most.


We have always had some disagreements in this game. I consider some updates lately a little shady - you consider my slow updates to be poor sportmanship, and so on. We have both, however, observed the line. I even found the vast majority of our disagreements quite good fun - nothing is really at stake here........or should I say nothing was.
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Posted by DrSpike on 20-12-2005 14:03:

I'll update shortly.......just need to see whether I'm supposed to rule Duke's guess in or out. It's late.
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Posted by rah on 20-12-2005 14:03:

quote:
Originally posted by DrSpike


There's a time when I would have argued.........said that mafia was spammier and hangman had more game in it......that lots of players have put lots of effort into making hangman a good forum game.



And that's why I didn't stop it back then. The game was organized well (stats and all) and people where having fun.

It doesn't seem that way anymore.
My only concern is that some of the OTers will disrupt the game. But that looks like it's already happening.

So I will agree not to delete any of the old thread, but the next thread will be started in the OT. If a new one is started here, I will rethink my position on deleting old threads.
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Posted by DrSpike on 20-12-2005 14:07:

quote:
Originally posted by rah


And that's why I didn't stop it back then. The game was organized well (stats and all) and people where having fun.

It doesn't seem that way anymore.
My only concern is that some of the OTers will disrupt the game. But that looks like it's already happening.

So I will agree not to delete any of the old thread, but the next thread will be started in the OT. If a new one is started here, I will rethink my position on deleting old threads.


Fair enough; no complaints here.
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Posted by joncha on 20-12-2005 14:11:

I think we should have a poll on which one we'd prefer:

A) move it to the OT, and keep all the old threads
B) leave it here and lose the old posts

I prefer B) because I don't care about my post count and I think the OT will kill the game. We are just going through another one of the game's hiccups now and whining and sniping aside, I think it was actually sorted out.
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Posted by duke o' york on 20-12-2005 14:11:

Thanks for your understanding rah. I can see "interesting things" happening to the thread in OT, but if we want to continue playing word games then maybe OG is no longer suitable, especially if people are going to get so competitive.
What's invalid about my guess? It came at a time at which guesses are legal, and it must be right if you're considering whether it's legal or not....
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Posted by Jaguar on 20-12-2005 14:16:

Demogames have been through worse, with respect to both spamming and dishonesty, but they have been allowed to sort themselves out.
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Posted by Ljube on 20-12-2005 14:18:

Duke's guess is perfectly legal. Time to update Doc.
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Posted by duke o' york on 20-12-2005 14:19:

As a founder of CFC's original demogame (although it was Duck of Flanders' idea), then it's a shame to hear you say that, despite the fact I have no time to play them any more.
But can we keep the discussion on the future of the game to a minimum, let rah's decision be the ultimate arbiter of this game's destination, and keep playing?
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Posted by DrSpike on 20-12-2005 14:20:

Ljube/Duke: You are right - I wasn't sure if we forced the update to occur after 2 guesses, or whether the guess word any time rule trumped it. From looking over the rules again I see it's the former. It's not a correct guess though.

_ I _ E D

Used: Y M R L W + Biped

4 guesses remaining
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Posted by joncha on 20-12-2005 14:21:

Maybe we need a "future of hangman" thread, because I think it warrants a full discussion. Rah has left at least one other alternative open.
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Posted by Jaguar on 20-12-2005 14:22:

Duke's guess is legal, although it seems the rules are slightly contradictory on that point. Rule 2 states that guesses should be in twos, but Rule 6 says you can guess the word at any time.
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Given his excellent SIG, I will say that this Jaguar is a man who has wisdom. - Philosophiser


Posted by Ljube on 20-12-2005 14:24:

Rules are not contradictory.

K
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Posted by duke o' york on 20-12-2005 14:25:

The guess was wrong, although I think that using the past tense should be added to rule 2, or whichever it is that says that plurals are not allowed. Nice loophole Spike.
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Posted by DrSpike on 20-12-2005 14:26:

I don't think the situation is sorted out now in OG. Having new hangman threads in the OT seems the best solution to me. Probably the scores would have to be reset, but I've most to lose, and I still think its the best choice.

I do not see any rationale for deleting the rich history of threads we have. The game may well be more suited to OT these days, but we've played it for some time, and it would be a shame to lose that.
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Posted by Nikolai on 20-12-2005 14:27:

quote:
Originally posted by rah
So I will agree not to delete any of the old thread, but the next thread will be started in the OT. If a new one is started here, I will rethink my position on deleting old threads.


A wise and good decision.
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Posted by Ljube on 20-12-2005 14:27:

quote:
Originally posted by duke o' york
The guess was wrong, although I think that using the past tense should be added to rule 2, or whichever it is that says that plurals are not allowed. Nice loophole Spike.



There is no rule saying that plurals are not allowed.
In fact plurals are allowed.
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Posted by Jaguar on 20-12-2005 14:28:

quote:
Originally posted by duke o' york
The guess was wrong, although I think that using the past tense should be added to rule 2, or whichever it is that says that plurals are not allowed. Nice loophole Spike.

Past tense has been used for a while. Fizzed, etc.
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Given his excellent SIG, I will say that this Jaguar is a man who has wisdom. - Philosophiser


Posted by DrSpike on 20-12-2005 14:28:

quote:
Originally posted by duke o' york
The guess was wrong, although I think that using the past tense should be added to rule 2, or whichever it is that says that plurals are not allowed. Nice loophole Spike.


We've always used words in the past tense. What word game doesn't?
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Posted by joncha on 20-12-2005 14:28:

How exactly would a move to the OT be helpful?
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Posted by Nikolai on 20-12-2005 14:29:

P
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Posted by DrSpike on 20-12-2005 14:29:

quote:
Originally posted by Ljube



There is no rule saying that plurals are not allowed.
In fact plurals are allowed.


Don't be awkward.

We have:

If the word is exactly 5 letters and the last letter is S, the first four letters must not make a standard english word.
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Posted by Ljube on 20-12-2005 14:31:

quote:
Originally posted by joncha
How exactly would a move to the OT be helpful?



It would preserve the game history and broaden the player base. This game is becoming an elite club as it is now.
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Posted by joncha on 20-12-2005 14:37:

If, as Spike says, the problems haven't been fixed, simply moving the game to the OT will solve nothing. I think we should address them (along with any details in the rules that may still be outstanding) before we move the game. We don't have many posts left in this thread, so we should probably do it in another in the Other Games forum.
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Posted by Rasputin on 20-12-2005 14:37:

and so the kids broke their toy...


Delete all the old threads , keep your scores and move to OT ....
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Posted by Nikolai on 20-12-2005 14:41:

No, there is no gain in deleting the old threads, but any new thread on hangman, playing thread or discussion thread, must be posted in the OT. If a mod has decided something, it's so, whether we like it or not! We can argue, but not here in the OG forum.
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Posted by Rasputin on 20-12-2005 14:44:

True True....

Lets hope the other games dont fall to the same demise....

But as their is real skill in Mafia then i shou think not
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Posted by joncha on 20-12-2005 14:48:

quote:
Originally posted by Nikolai
No, there is no gain in deleting the old threads, but any new thread on hangman, playing thread or discussion thread, must be posted in the OT. If a mod has decided something, it's so, whether we like it or not! We can argue, but not here in the OG forum.


No, he said the next hangman thread, ie, the next game thread.

If he meant discussion thread as well, then oops.

Hangman Discussion Thread

Let's leave this thread to playing the game, and discuss the issues there.
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Posted by fishsticks on 21-12-2005 13:08:

I had been planning to jump in and hadn't had a chance to get a guess in yet.
But by my reckoning it's been almost 23 hours since the second guess was posted. What happens if 24 hours runs out (as would happen at 22:29 GMT, an hour and 20 from now)?
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Posted by duke o' york on 21-12-2005 13:10:


A new player can post a new word, and we all shake our heads at Spike's sheer uselessness.
But he's still got just over an hour.
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Posted by joncha on 21-12-2005 13:11:

Welcome aboard, Jamski.
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Posted by DrSpike on 21-12-2005 13:30:

_ I _ E D

Used: Y M R L W + Biped P K

2 guesses remaining
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Posted by civman2000 on 21-12-2005 13:33:

V
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Posted by Rasputin on 21-12-2005 14:00:

spikey Sighting !!!
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Posted by fishsticks on 21-12-2005 15:37:

So... does this mean we wait another 20 hours now?
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Posted by joncha on 21-12-2005 15:39:

That depends on how awkward Spike feels like being today.
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Posted by DrSpike on 22-12-2005 10:32:

Or, to give you the non-biased version it depends on when Spike gets in from work.

_ I V E D

Used: Y M R L W + Biped P K

2 guesses remaining
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Posted by Chaunk on 22-12-2005 10:44:

Jived
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Posted by civman2000 on 22-12-2005 11:11:

HIVED
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Posted by Paddy the Scot on 22-12-2005 11:21:

Cived
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Posted by civman2000 on 22-12-2005 11:24:

quote:
Originally posted by Paddy the Scot
Cived

Rather pointless guess. Not only is it not a word, but two out of two possible guesses have already been made .
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sapIkenak-atAbin inagalasIfi? (Can you speak Inagalasi?) If not, click here and learn how!
PTWDG Roleplay Team: The de la Civ Clan, currently Roberto Menor (in Pamplona) and Caterina Ordonez (in Pamplona). Also: George Finkle, born in the barbarian regions of southern Espana, and Leading S.P.I.N. Correspondent to Espana and the Vatican.


Posted by Chaunk on 22-12-2005 11:29:

It should be a word though!
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Posted by Ljube on 22-12-2005 11:32:

I think it should be spelt civved.
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Posted by Nikolai on 22-12-2005 12:17:

quote:
Originally posted by civman2000

Rather pointless guess. Not only is it not a word, but two out of two possible guesses have already been made .


We can guess as many words we want, but only one each.
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Posted by joncha on 22-12-2005 12:23:

quote:
Originally posted by DrSpike
Or, to give you the non-biased version it depends on when Spike gets in from work.


It's amazing the things you find when digging through old threads.

quote:
More whinging and I will update once per day just to spite you. Yes, I am that awkward. You've been warned.

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Posted by civman2000 on 22-12-2005 13:00:

quote:
Originally posted by Nikolai


We can guess as many words we want, but only one each.

But there are only 2 guesses left, so once two guesses have been made, further guesses are pointless.
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sapIkenak-atAbin inagalasIfi? (Can you speak Inagalasi?) If not, click here and learn how!
PTWDG Roleplay Team: The de la Civ Clan, currently Roberto Menor (in Pamplona) and Caterina Ordonez (in Pamplona). Also: George Finkle, born in the barbarian regions of southern Espana, and Leading S.P.I.N. Correspondent to Espana and the Vatican.


Posted by DrSpike on 22-12-2005 13:07:

quote:
Originally posted by joncha


It's amazing the things you find when digging through old threads.



It's true, I am that awkward. Following lots of whinging though - not today.

The word is Chaunks, and the password is hopethevowelsarentguessedtoofast
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Posted by DrSpike on 22-12-2005 13:09:

Plus you were all wrong about the guesses - an update must occur after a word guess. So all the guesses after Chaunk's guess were invalid.
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Posted by Jaguar on 22-12-2005 13:41:

quote:
Originally posted by DrSpike


It's true, I am that awkward. Following lots of whinging though - not today.

The word is Chaunks, and the password is hopethevowelsarentguessedtoofast


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The KING OF THE JEWS became the SCOURGE OF THE JEWS, and the SCOURGE OF THE GENTILES, became the KING OF THE GENTILES!~ YES! All by the Cross! "His Blood Be Upon Us and On Our Children! Screamed the Jewry!" - Philosophiser
Given his excellent SIG, I will say that this Jaguar is a man who has wisdom. - Philosophiser


Posted by Rasputin on 22-12-2005 13:55:

and so the end is near....
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Posted by Chaunk on 22-12-2005 14:05:

_ _ _ _ _ _ _ _

8 letters

10 guesses.
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Posted by joncha on 22-12-2005 14:08:

A
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Posted by Ljube on 22-12-2005 15:02:

quote:
Originally posted by DrSpike
Plus you were all wrong about the guesses - an update must occur after a word guess. So all the guesses after Chaunk's guess were invalid.



Word guesses are never invalid unless they are made contrary to rule 7. Word guesses must be counted.

The provision an update must also occur after each word guess defines that the word setter cannot delay the update more than 24 hours after a word guess has been made. It does not disallow subsequent word guesses which must all be counted.
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Posted by Nikolai on 22-12-2005 15:08:

I agree with Ljube.

Y
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The LORD your God is with you, he is mighty to save. He will take great delight in you, he will quiet you with his love, he will rejoice over you with singing. - Zephaniah 3:17
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Posted by Chaunk on 22-12-2005 15:10:

A _ _ _ _ _ _ _

Incorrect
Y

9 guesses remaining.
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Posted by Ljube on 22-12-2005 15:11:

T
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Posted by Rasputin on 22-12-2005 15:27:

V
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I admit it, I am a LOST Fanatic
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Posted by Chaunk on 22-12-2005 15:33:

A _ _ _ _ T _ _

8 letters:

Incorrect
Y, V
8 guesses remaining.
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Posted by Nikolai on 22-12-2005 15:39:

N
__________________
Do not fear, for I am with you; Do not anxiously look about you, for I am your God. -Isaiah 41:10
The LORD your God is with you, he is mighty to save. He will take great delight in you, he will quiet you with his love, he will rejoice over you with singing. - Zephaniah 3:17
Get The List for cIV here!


Posted by DrSpike on 22-12-2005 15:44:

quote:
Originally posted by Ljube



Word guesses are never invalid unless they are made contrary to rule 7. Word guesses must be counted.

The provision an update must also occur after each word guess defines that the word setter cannot delay the update more than 24 hours after a word guess has been made. It does not disallow subsequent word guesses which must all be counted.


Well I'm not going to go through all the threads but my recollection was that to stop the possibility of an infinite string of word guesses we specifically added the rule to say that a word guess triggers an update in the same way the second letter guess does, and thus all guesses after are invalid. I'm also sure that (although this is a relatively recent rule addition) we have ruled it that way in the past.

Perhaps other rules junkies will comment.
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Posted by joncha on 22-12-2005 15:46:

I tend to agree with Spike, but let's discuss it in the other thread, as this one is quickly running out of posts...
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Posted by Ljube on 22-12-2005 17:10:

quote:
Originally posted by DrSpike


Well I'm not going to go through all the threads but my recollection was that to stop the possibility of an infinite string of word guesses we specifically added the rule to say that a word guess triggers an update in the same way the second letter guess does, and thus all guesses after are invalid. I'm also sure that (although this is a relatively recent rule addition) we have ruled it that way in the past.



Although it was your intention all along, we have never ruled a second word guess invalid. We added rule 7 to prevent an exploit that can happen if there are 2 guesses left and 2 possible words available where a player can guess a letter first and then guess the other word thus winning the game by making essentially two consecutive word guesses.

I don't see why we would forbid a string of word guesses. In some instances it is the only way for someone to get a point. It is only used when there are more guesses remaining than possible words or when there are so many possible words that the situation is hopeless anyway.

Since the rule has never been abused I don’t see the reason to change it. Word guesses are counted at any time provided they satisfy the conditions set out in rule 7.
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Posted by Ljube on 22-12-2005 17:59:

I wasn't lazy and went through the threads. I found this in Hangman XI (the first time that an update must also occur after each word guess appeared in the rules):


quote:

originally posted by me on 5 August 2004
I think when someone guesses the word it should be updated immediately. Could you correct the rules to that effect joncha?


Joncha's reply:

quote:

Sure. Later. Me go sleep now.



And that's how this thing got into the rules.
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Posted by joncha on 22-12-2005 18:08:

That's two (now three ) less posts for this thread.

Please, please, PLEASE continue the rules discussion in the other thread.
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Eventis be Yarrr and woo ~ (mostly) error free for 5 days.


Posted by snoopy369 on 22-12-2005 20:05:

O
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Posted by Chaunk on 23-12-2005 02:51:

A _ _ _ _ T O _

8 letters:

Incorrect
Y, V, N
7 guesses remaining.
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Posted by Paddy the Scot on 23-12-2005 04:00:

U
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Posted by fishsticks on 23-12-2005 06:12:

R
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Posted by Chaunk on 23-12-2005 06:16:

A _ _ U _ T O R

8 letters:

Incorrect
Y, V, N
7 guesses remaining.

I wonder if anyone can guess it from that.
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Posted by Ljube on 23-12-2005 06:21:

I don't know, I can try.

abductor


certainly fits
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Posted by Chaunk on 23-12-2005 06:34:

I'm afraid not.

A _ _ U _ T O R

8 letters:

Incorrect
Y, V, N, Abductor
6 guesses remaining.
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Posted by civman2000 on 23-12-2005 06:38:

ADJUSTOR.

(if I'm right, someone else can do the next word--I won't have regular access to computers starting tomorrow)
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"[Columbus's conquests] can also be seen as a bloody atrocity...genocide and slavery." --James Loewen, Lies My Teacher Told Me
sapIkenak-atAbin inagalasIfi? (Can you speak Inagalasi?) If not, click here and learn how!
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Posted by Chaunk on 23-12-2005 06:54:

I'm afraid not.

A _ _ U _ T O R

8 letters:

Incorrect
Y, V, N, Abductor, Adjustor
5 guesses remaining.
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Posted by Sparrowhawk on 23-12-2005 07:08:

Hmmm, two incorrect word guesses.

C

Lets try narrowing it down a little more then.
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Posted by snoopy369 on 23-12-2005 07:50:

D
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Posted by Chaunk on 23-12-2005 09:14:



Adductor indeed Over to Snoopy.
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Posted by fishsticks on 23-12-2005 13:01:

Nice catch. I'm sure that's just how you planned it
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Posted by snoopy369 on 24-12-2005 00:08:

It was. Now stop putting useless posts in this thread so I can actually *finish* my word

_ _ _ _ _

5 letters, 10 guesses remaining.

Guessed:
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Posted by joncha on 24-12-2005 00:16:

Indeed. A
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Posted by Jaguar on 24-12-2005 01:01:

H
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Eschewing silly games since December 4, 2005
The KING OF THE JEWS became the SCOURGE OF THE JEWS, and the SCOURGE OF THE GENTILES, became the KING OF THE GENTILES!~ YES! All by the Cross! "His Blood Be Upon Us and On Our Children! Screamed the Jewry!" - Philosophiser
Given his excellent SIG, I will say that this Jaguar is a man who has wisdom. - Philosophiser


Posted by snoopy369 on 24-12-2005 01:33:

_ _ _ _ _

5 letters, 8 guesses remaining.

Guessed: AH

BTW, i work retail, so don't expcet this to finish before christmas.
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Posted by Nikolai on 24-12-2005 02:32:

E
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The LORD your God is with you, he is mighty to save. He will take great delight in you, he will quiet you with his love, he will rejoice over you with singing. - Zephaniah 3:17
Get The List for cIV here!


Posted by Ljube on 24-12-2005 08:44:

Y
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Posted by snoopy369 on 24-12-2005 20:51:

_ _ _ _ _

5 letters, 6 guesses remaining.

Guessed: AHEY
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Posted by joncha on 24-12-2005 20:52:

N
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Eventis be Yarrr and woo ~ (mostly) error free for 5 days.


Posted by fishsticks on 24-12-2005 21:07:

T
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Posted by snoopy369 on 24-12-2005 22:25:

_ _ _ _ _

5 letters, 4 guesses remaining.

Guessed: HEY NAT

teh complexity!
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Posted by Sparrowhawk on 24-12-2005 22:54:

L
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Posted by Jaguar on 24-12-2005 23:43:

U
__________________
Supporting the 13-2 Indianapolis Colts
Eschewing silly games since December 4, 2005
The KING OF THE JEWS became the SCOURGE OF THE JEWS, and the SCOURGE OF THE GENTILES, became the KING OF THE GENTILES!~ YES! All by the Cross! "His Blood Be Upon Us and On Our Children! Screamed the Jewry!" - Philosophiser
Given his excellent SIG, I will say that this Jaguar is a man who has wisdom. - Philosophiser


Posted by snoopy369 on 24-12-2005 23:45:

_ L U _ _

5 letters, 4 guesses remaining.

Guessed: HEY NAT

teh guessed letters finally!
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Posted by joncha on 24-12-2005 23:52:

F

I hope rah won't mind this going over 500 by a few posts... it would be nice to finish off the word.
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Eventis be Yarrr and woo ~ (mostly) error free for 5 days.


Posted by Ljube on 25-12-2005 02:06:

I'm sure rah will show his tolerance as always.

B
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Posted by snoopy369 on 25-12-2005 03:43:

_ L U _ _

5 letters, 2 guesses remaining.

Guessed: HEY NAT FB

teh 500th guess!!

Leaving on an aeroplane and whatnot in about 15 minutes. Unclear access to internets in next 48 hours. Will try ...

Oh, and MERRY XMAS
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Posted by Chaunk on 25-12-2005 04:47:

G?
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Posted by Nikolai on 25-12-2005 09:22:

So, what do we do? Do we start a new thread in the OT or do we await the final decision before we move on?
__________________
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The LORD your God is with you, he is mighty to save. He will take great delight in you, he will quiet you with his love, he will rejoice over you with singing. - Zephaniah 3:17
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Posted by joncha on 25-12-2005 13:24:

I say we wait before we open a new thread anywhere. Let's use the discussion thread to figure out where we want to go from here.
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Eventis be Yarrr and woo ~ (mostly) error free for 5 days.


Posted by Nikolai on 25-12-2005 16:15:

I agree.
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The LORD your God is with you, he is mighty to save. He will take great delight in you, he will quiet you with his love, he will rejoice over you with singing. - Zephaniah 3:17
Get The List for cIV here!


Posted by snoopy369 on 25-12-2005 16:27:

_ L U _ _

5 letters, 1 guesses remaining.

Guessed: HEY NAT FBG

Hmm...
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Posted by fishsticks on 25-12-2005 17:12:

C
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Posted by snoopy369 on 25-12-2005 22:13:

C L U _ _

5 letters, 1 guesses remaining.

Guessed: HEY NAT FBG
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Posted by joncha on 25-12-2005 22:24:

CLUMP
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Posted by snoopy369 on 26-12-2005 09:27:

quote:
Originally posted by joncha
CLUMP




And thus ends Hangman XXIX...
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Posted by rah on 29-12-2005 06:30:

Please let me know when someone has archived the thread (or copied the stats for the record) and I'll delete it.

Please feel free to start a new thread here.
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