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Which US PResidents were Horrid?: Part II

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  • #31
    No, there is nothing in the Constitution that explicitly stated that a president has those powers, you mentioned, Ramo.

    But if we want to see the Constitution as something static, rather than a dynamic document, then in that viewpoint, Lincoln could not have reasonably practiced the dire emergency powers he used.

    But since the Constitution is a dynamic document . . . . . .
    A lot of Republicans are not racist, but a lot of racists are Republican.

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    • #32
      But if we want to see the Constitution as something static, rather than a dynamic document, then in that viewpoint, Lincoln could not have reasonably practiced the dire emergency powers he used.
      That's entirely the point - he couldn't do what he did without an Amendment.
      Follow me on Twitter: http://twitter.com/DaveDaDouche
      Read my seldom updated blog where I talk to myself: http://davedadouche.blogspot.com/

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      • #33
        Have you ever heard of a national emergency??

        Secession, then the creation of the Confederacy, and then the War of Southern Stupidity threatened the existence of the United States.
        A lot of Republicans are not racist, but a lot of racists are Republican.

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        • #34
          Have you ever heard of a national emergency??
          I don't recall the Constitution being subject to arbitrarily declared (or even legitimate) national emergencies.
          Follow me on Twitter: http://twitter.com/DaveDaDouche
          Read my seldom updated blog where I talk to myself: http://davedadouche.blogspot.com/

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          • #35
            How many times does the argument over Lincoln's presidency comes up here on Apolyton anway??

            Every other week??

            I need to get to bed -- I'm not sure what biological clocks you Rebels have.
            A lot of Republicans are not racist, but a lot of racists are Republican.

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            • #36
              No, there is nothing in the Constitution that explicitly stated that a president has those powers, you mentioned, Ramo.
              More to the point, there's nothing in the Constitution that explictly or implicitly states that Congress (which is responsible for making laws, not the President) had any of the powers I mentioned.

              But if we want to see the Constitution as something static, rather than a dynamic document,
              Static, my arse. Ever hear of these things called Amendments?

              What do you think is the purpose of the Constitution? If the President or Congress can make arbitrary changes to the Constitution simply by calling it "dynamic," it no longer means anything.

              That's not to say that usurping the Constitution is necessarily unjustified (although it was unjustifed every time Lincoln did so), but it always is, by definition, unconstitutional.
              "Beware of the man who works hard to learn something, learns it, and finds himself no wiser than before. He is full of murderous resentment of people who are ignorant without having come by their ignorance the hard way. "
              -Bokonon

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              • #37
                poor Millard Filmore Bad President, but you can't help but feel sorry for him all things considered.

                I'm surprised Wilson has so many votes. Just because the man was a racist doesn't mean that he was a bad president. I don't believe he did anything to enflame race relations, or do anything against blacks.
                "Chegitz, still angry about the fall of the Soviet Union in 1991?
                You provide no source. You PROVIDE NOTHING! And yet you want to destroy capitalism.. you criminal..." - Fez

                "I was hoping for a Communist utopia that would last forever." - Imran Siddiqui

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                • #38
                  a double-post
                  A lot of Republicans are not racist, but a lot of racists are Republican.

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                  • #39
                    Originally posted by orange
                    poor Millard Filmore Bad President, but you can't help but feel sorry for him all things considered.

                    I'm surprised Wilson has so many votes. Just because the man was a racist doesn't mean that he was a bad president. I don't believe he did anything to enflame race relations, or do anything against blacks.
                    At the convention of the League of Nations after World War I, Wilson was one of the people who refused to discuss the treatment of race minorities in countries such as United States. Africans, and African-Americans had to set up a separate convention in Paris for that purpose.

                    He also refused to consider passing a federal anti-lynching law in the United States, and set up segregation in the public facilities of Washington DC.

                    He also implied that he supported the Ku Klux Klan by praising the movie, "Birth of a Nation" as something that was all too true.
                    A lot of Republicans are not racist, but a lot of racists are Republican.

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                    • #40
                      Does that make him a bad president though?
                      "Chegitz, still angry about the fall of the Soviet Union in 1991?
                      You provide no source. You PROVIDE NOTHING! And yet you want to destroy capitalism.. you criminal..." - Fez

                      "I was hoping for a Communist utopia that would last forever." - Imran Siddiqui

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                      • #41
                        Does that make him a bad president though?
                        If that doesn't, the Espionage Act, WWI, the draft, his imperialism in Haiti, the Domincan Republic, Nicaragua, and Mexico certainly do.
                        "Beware of the man who works hard to learn something, learns it, and finds himself no wiser than before. He is full of murderous resentment of people who are ignorant without having come by their ignorance the hard way. "
                        -Bokonon

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                        • #42
                          I'm surprised to see Nixon and Harding absent from the poll.
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                          • #43
                            Regarding Lincoln, I'm going to throw my hat in the same ring as Floyd and Ramo--Lincoln violated the Constitution, hands down, no questions asked.

                            MrFun, you might have an inkling of a chance in arguing that Lincoln was justified in violating the constitution (although in nearly all instances I believe that he was not), but there is no possible way that you could reasonably argue that Lincoln did not violate the Constition.
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                            • #44
                              Add another voice that Lincoln violated the constitution. And yes, some say he was justified in doing so... though I believe suspending habeus corpus can never really be justified.
                              “I give you a new commandment, that you love one another. Just as I have loved you, you also should love one another. By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you have love for one another.”
                              - John 13:34-35 (NRSV)

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                              • #45
                                You know what?? Yes, Lincoln did violate the Constitution, but he was definitely justified in doing so.

                                What president would not have a compelling interest in preserving their own country??
                                A lot of Republicans are not racist, but a lot of racists are Republican.

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