Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

[civil] "Greece moves closer to eurozone exit after delaying €300m repayment to IMF "

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • [civil] "Greece moves closer to eurozone exit after delaying €300m repayment to IMF "

    Greece has moved closer to default and possible exit from the eurozone after telling the International Monetary Fund it would not be making a debt repayment of €300m (£219m) due on Friday.

    A crisis that has been going on for more than five years entered a new phase when Athens surprised the IMF by saying it intended to bundle up four payments in June totalling €1.6bn and make them all at the end of the month.

    The move came as the Greek government reacted angrily to what was seen as an ultimatum from its creditors – including the IMF – that demanded further austerity and unpopular reforms to VAT, pensions and wage bargaining as the price for €7.2bn in fresh financial help.

    Although Greece’s financial position has become increasingly serious in recent months, Athens had the ability to make the €300m payment and the country’s prime minister, Alexis Tsipras, gave the IMF managing director, Christine Lagarde, an assurance earlier this week it would be made on time.

    Asked about the repayment due on Friday, Lagarde told reporters: “The payment had been honoured and will be honoured. I think his words were, ‘Do not worry.’ I’m confident that will continue to be the case.”

    Instead, the decision to delay payments appears to be a show of defiance by Athens against what it sees as unacceptably harsh terms being demanded by its creditors. This increases the chances of Greece defaulting on its debts, losing the support for its weak financial sector from the European Central Bank, and eventually being forced to leave the single currency.

    Fresh from talks in Brussels, Tsipras faced outrage on Thursday from highly sceptical members of his own Syriza party. A five-page ultimatum from creditors, presented by the European commission president, Jean-Claude Juncker, was variously described as shocking, provocative, disgraceful and dishonourable.

    “It will never pass,” said Greece’s deputy social security minister, Dimitris Stratoulis. “If they don’t back down, the country won’t be lost … there are alternatives that would cost less than our signing a disgraceful and dishonourable agreement.”

    Tsipras had presented the so-called troika of lenders – the EU, the ECB and IMF – with his own 47-page list of proposed reforms, but must now decide to accede to creditors’ demands or take on hardliners in his own party. Actions being asked of Greece include spending cuts and tax increases worth 2% of the country’s GDP in the form of pension and VAT reform – anathema to a party catapulted into office on the promise of terminating austerity.

    On Thursday night Tsipras was seen to be leaning on the side of rejection. Officials described him as telling associates: “Such extremist proposals cannot be accepted by the Greek government. Everyone must understand that the Greek people have greatly suffered over the last five years and some have to stop playing games at their expense.” There was also speculation that he will call a general election over the debt impasse.

    News that Greece would not be making its scheduled IMF payment on time came after the close of European markets, but shares fell sharply on Wall Street.

    The IMF issued a short statement in which it confirmed Greece’s plan to bundle up its June payments but stressed that the rules that permitted the move were supposed to be for countries facing administrative problems.

    “Under an executive board decision adopted in the late 1970s, country members can ask to bundle together multiple principal payments falling due in a calendar month (payments of interest cannot be included in the bundle). The decision was intended to address the administrative difficulty of making multiple payments in a short period,” said IMF spokesman Gerry Rice.

    Greece’s finance minister, Yanis Varoufakis, told Sky News: “Objectively speaking, we have until the 30 June because this is when the extension of the agreement with our creditors expires.”

    But he conceded that Greece would be unable to continue making repayments at some point.

    In Brussels, officials said Athens had 10 days to strike a deal. Technical teams of negotiators from the EC, the ECB and IMF hope to wrap up what is known as a “staff level agreement” by 14 June, four days before the next scheduled session of eurozone finance ministers and 11 days before a Brussels summit of EU leaders on 25 June.

    Both Juncker and Jeroen Dijsselbloem, who heads the euro group of eurozone finance ministers, insisted that not enough progress had been made in the talks so far. The European commission chief said he would ask Tsipras back to Brussels for more negotiations in the next few days.
    Athens takes creditor by surprise, saying it will bundle together €1.6bn of debt payments due to International Monetary Fund and settle up on 30 June


    It's weird how the electorate in a democracy seems to demand the impossible. They can't stay on the Euro without austerity, but neither leaving the euro nor austerity is popular politically.

  • #2
    The move came as the Greek government reacted angrily to what was seen as an ultimatum from its creditors – including the IMF – that demanded further austerity and unpopular reforms to VAT, pensions and wage bargaining as the price for €7.2bn in fresh financial help.
    Hopefully it's not as simple as this, but it certainly come off like
    "Here's a loan, we expect you to pay it back."
    "HOW DARE YOU"
    <p style="font-size:1024px">HTML is disabled in signatures </p>

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by loinburger View Post
      Hopefully it's not as simple as this, but it certainly come off like
      "Here's a loan, we expect you to pay it back."
      "HOW DARE YOU"
      I'd wager that's what it boils down to.
      I make no bones about my moral support for [terrorist] organizations. - chegitz guevara
      For those who aspire to live in a high cost, high tax, big government place, our nation and the world offers plenty of options. Vermont, Canada and Venezuela all offer you the opportunity to live in the socialist, big government paradise you long for. –Senator Rubio

      Comment


      • #4
        I am one that is of the opinion that a Grexit would be good for both the EU and Greece. Maybe Greece could adopt a somewhat British type plan and exit the currency while still staying in the Union.
        "I am sick and tired of people who say that if you debate and you disagree with this administration somehow you're not patriotic. We should stand up and say we are Americans and we have a right to debate and disagree with any administration." - Hillary Clinton, 2003

        Comment


        • #5
          In the latest global competitiveness report, http://reports.weforum.org/global-co...2015/rankings/, Greece ranks 81 out of 144. While Greece is ahead of Zambia (the last country to delay an IMF payment), it ranks behind such powerhouses as Algeria, Botswana, Sri Lanka, Georgia, and Montenegro.
          “It is no use trying to 'see through' first principles. If you see through everything, then everything is transparent. But a wholly transparent world is an invisible world. To 'see through' all things is the same as not to see.”

          ― C.S. Lewis, The Abolition of Man

          Comment


          • #6
            I am sure that they would love to enter the russian Eurasian economic union rather today than tomorrow.

            The only problem IMHO is, that Putin also sees Greece more of a burden than an asset and therefore doesn´t want them in it
            Tamsin (Lost Girl): "I am the Harbinger of Death. I arrive on winds of blessed air. Air that you no longer deserve."
            Tamsin (Lost Girl): "He has fallen in battle and I must take him to the Einherjar in Valhalla"

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by Proteus_MST View Post
              I am sure that they would love to enter the russian Eurasian economic union rather today than tomorrow.

              The only problem IMHO is, that Putin also sees Greece more of a burden than an asset and therefore doesn´t want them in it
              Putin is far better off at the moment having them in the EU where they can exercise veto power on the upcoming sanction renewal. Hmmm...Maybe they could sell their vote for the imf payment!
              "I am sick and tired of people who say that if you debate and you disagree with this administration somehow you're not patriotic. We should stand up and say we are Americans and we have a right to debate and disagree with any administration." - Hillary Clinton, 2003

              Comment


              • #8
                Apparently this doesn't count as a default as long as it is bundled with the other payments by the end of the month. This is an old I'M rule from the early 1970's to help newly independent 3rd world countries who lacked the administrative ability to process multiple payments quickly.
                Try http://wordforge.net/index.php for discussion and debate.

                Comment


                • #9
                  The "proposals" are not going to pass because they are detached from reality.

                  Now if the European elite wants to commit suicide, it's their prerogative.

                  Why the people should care still baffles me.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by PLATO View Post
                    I am one that is of the opinion that a Grexit would be good for both the EU and Greece. Maybe Greece could adopt a somewhat British type plan and exit the currency while still staying in the Union.
                    Originally posted by pchang View Post
                    In the latest global competitiveness report, http://reports.weforum.org/global-co...2015/rankings/, Greece ranks 81 out of 144. While Greece is ahead of Zambia (the last country to delay an IMF payment), it ranks behind such powerhouses as Algeria, Botswana, Sri Lanka, Georgia, and Montenegro.
                    Yet they reject any suggestion that they should up their game. Just like they reject any suggestion to actually spend less than they make.

                    It isn't a size thing because Singapore is small but usually ranks #1 in competitiveness.
                    Try http://wordforge.net/index.php for discussion and debate.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      For example, one of the absurd proposals is to raise VAT in the islands, making them automatically uncompetitive.

                      There are dozens of other silly issues like that.

                      Why should a program that has evidently failed, continue?

                      It won't.


                      I'll try and find what happens to a country that accepts what some neoliberal nazis want (Latvia) and what happens when it doesn't (Iceland)


                      But these are all secondary.


                      If schoible wants to go down as the one who broke europe, the whole continent will laugh (the people sure will)

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Dinner View Post
                        Yet they reject any suggestion that they should up their game. Just like they reject any suggestion to actually spend less than they make.

                        It isn't a size thing because Singapore is small but usually ranks #1 in competitiveness.
                        They are extremly good at One City Challenge
                        Tamsin (Lost Girl): "I am the Harbinger of Death. I arrive on winds of blessed air. Air that you no longer deserve."
                        Tamsin (Lost Girl): "He has fallen in battle and I must take him to the Einherjar in Valhalla"

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by loinburger View Post
                          Hopefully it's not as simple as this, but it certainly come off like
                          "Here's a loan, we expect you to pay it back."
                          "HOW DARE YOU"
                          it's not surprising that people take this view when the issue is framed thus. "financial help" makes it sound as if the IMF/EU are funding greek public services when in fact the money was used to shore up european banks with exposure to greece to save them and the euro; greece is using the new money to pay back the loans given to it to pay the banks off. as a condition of this 'rescue plan', greece was compelled to adopt measures that caused its economy to shrink by 25% and unemployment to skyrocket. they now have a bigger debt than in 2009 and a much smaller economy from which to pay it off.
                          "The Christian way has not been tried and found wanting, it has been found to be hard and left untried" - GK Chesterton.

                          "The most obvious predicition about the future is that it will be mostly like the past" - Alain de Botton

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            I figured there might be more to it, the IMF doesn't have the most stellar reputation (then again, neither does Greece)
                            <p style="font-size:1024px">HTML is disabled in signatures </p>

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by loinburger View Post
                              I figured there might be more to it, the IMF doesn't have the most stellar reputation (then again, neither does Greece)
                              yes indeed, and there are certainly plenty of problems on the greek side too. however, greece was given a totally unworkable plan from the start and then blamed for its inevitable failure. a lot has been written on this subject in the nearly 1000 post thread on syriza's election win. to avoid repeating myself i'll repost my analysis of the first bailout fom that thread.

                              the way you [colon] have written it, it seems like the international community tried its best to save greece, but the incorrigible greeks just wouldn't mend their ways and now find themselves in a desperate situation because of it. it's not surprising that people have the views they do, when the issue is framed thus. however, this version of events has nothing to do with reality.

                              the problem with greece at start of the crisis was that it had a debt (caused by lax public finances) that it couldn't pay. the plan to 'save' it was not to write off the debt, but to give greece loans and impose conditions that would inevitably shrink the economy; on its face the plan appeared to be absolute madness: a country that couldn't pay its debts being offered more debt as a solution.

                              it's important to understand the motivations of those involved. default for greece would have meant leaving the euro, possibly the EU; in other words humiliation for any mainstream national politician (and we must not forget just how attached to the EU mainstream politicians in the EU are) who took that course. on the EU side everyone was worried that a greek default and exit would provoke contagion: the other PIIGS leaving the euro and a banking collapse; perhaps you recall the various reports from banks predicting famine, war, and pestilence if greece defaulted, which could be summarised thus: banks say banking collapse would be bad.

                              if we look at the 'rescues' as if they were intended to resolve greece's problems, then they appear completely unworkable and an abject failure; they appear absurd in fact (and this was pointed out at the time). however, if we look at them as if they were intended to save the euro and shore up the banking system, then they make sense, and have in fact worked. the euro is still standing and banking system, while still somewhat shaky, is in much better shape than it was in 2008/9. the greek people though have paid the price. they were given a plan which couldn't possibly have worked and were blamed for its failure.
                              "The Christian way has not been tried and found wanting, it has been found to be hard and left untried" - GK Chesterton.

                              "The most obvious predicition about the future is that it will be mostly like the past" - Alain de Botton

                              Comment

                              Working...
                              X