Anyone remember Libya

[PLATO]

No we need to find a friendly general to step in and help the Libyans resume their proper place.

General Khalifa Haftar had been living right next to CIA headquarters for the last few years before the uprising.

[DaShi]

So basically you're saying that the best thing we can do for them is step back and don't interfere?

Wow, aren't you clever?

[OneFootInTheGrave]

So basically you're saying that the best thing we can do for them is step back and don't interfere?

We need to get better at judging where there is a consensus that help is needed, and act there.

Good example is the French with Mali, they were fully supported by the locals and the action therefore made sense, another one would have been Rwanda or Darfur where we just did not give a **** as there are really no resources that interest us (mainly EU/US).

It is not that it is impossible to make such judgements, it is only that "we" as Europe/US are interested in the leadership which will do as we say, no matter what they do locally.

Iraq, Syria, Libya and the rest of the Arab spring was there to use a part of local population to replace rulers the west did not like. After the mission was accomplished, we largely did not give a ****.

Sure we are failing in Syria, even though the country is in ruins, but seeing who we tasked with taking Assad out, I guess everyone should be happy that he looks like he is staying, even Israel.

Libya is now a destroyed country thanks to our actions, and we do not give a flying **** about it.

I bet those Libyans love us for it, and will be so much harder to make terrorists out of them, as they love us for giving them freedom to live in a ****hole that we left behind.

[The Mad Monk]

Well, Syrian rebels have now taken Mosul.

Yes, you heard that right.

They have successfully taken a major city in a different country.

[Dr Strangelove]

ISIS has been involved in both Syria and Iraq for a long time. Their goal is to carve out a state for Iraqi and Syrian Sunnis

[Egbert]

Life back to normal. Mission Accomplished.

"invade, forget, invade next country, repeat"

[OneFootInTheGrave]

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2014-07-26/u-s-evacuates-embassy-staff-in-libya-to-tunisia-due-to-violence.html

The U.S. State Department evacuated its Libyan embassy yesterday, sending staff elsewhere and advising all American citizens to leave the country after clashes between militias near the diplomatic offices in Tripoli.

freedom

[DinoDoc]

So basically you're saying that the best thing we can do for them is step back and don't interfere?

Perhaps the lesson here is not to intervene in foreign civil wars in which we lack any discernible interest in the outcome?

[Dinner]

Sadly, the dictator destroyed all of the civil institutions in the country so that now that he is gone there is very little holding it together. Was this unpredictable? No, but it is still a better outcome, at least in the long run, than having a ruthless dictator. The key is going to be disarming the militias, something which has not happened as yet, and rebuilding those civil institutions. It can happen but it will take time and concerted effort. Maybe, when the locals get tired of acting like barbarians, it can happen but until then they get what they deserve.

[Fake Boris]

You have an issue with Arabs.

[Fake Boris]

Perhaps the lesson here is not to intervene in foreign civil wars in which we lack any discernible interest in the outcome?

Even better, don't foster them.

[OneFootInTheGrave]

Even better, don't foster them.

We collectively are very far from that position.

[DinoDoc]

Even better, don't foster them.

We can hardly be held responsible for anything about the Libyan Civil War other than the outcome.

[Dinner]

You have an issue with Arabs.

Wait, so you think running around killing people and trying to carve out fiefdoms is an ok behavior? That is exactly what I would call acting like a barbarian especially since the militias use force and rule by fear. This is not an "Arab thing" this is a they're behaving like animals thing. You might not want to look at it but it is still true.

It's just so easy for people to dismiss actual actions and pretend the people who dare to mention those bad actions as some how being biased. It's a crock of ****.

[Fake Boris]

We can hardly be held responsible for anything about the Libyan Civil War other than the outcome.

False. Gaddafi was ousted on a French-led coup because he was about to replace the Franc CFA with his own African central bank.

While different groups joined the Libyan rebellion, it consisted mostly of foreign islamists.