Justify this list:

[Guynemer]

http://www.avclub.com/articles/the-15-best-videogames-of-the-00s,35642/

For those of you too lazy to click, noted pop-culture website A.V. Club has posted their top 15 games of the '00s:

15. SSX
14. The Sims
13. Ninja Gaiden
12. Braid
11. Advance Wars
10. Left 4 Dead
9. Final Fantasy XII
8. Grand Theft Auto: Vice City
7. Ico
6. World of Warcraft
5. Portal
4. Rock Band
3. Fallout 3
2. Katamari Damacy
1. BioShock



So, your challenge--justify this list.


You can't do it, can you?

[Asher]

It's very random.

And how SSX made the list is mind****ing to me.

[Guynemer]

Mindblowing is censored? Or did you say mind****ing?

But, yeah... SSX. Wow.

[Asher]

Mind f-u-c-k ing

It's much better than getting a bloooooooooooow.

[Guynemer]

But "mind****" typically has a different meaning than "mindblow". But, whatever.



How does one make a list of the best games of the 00s and not mention HL2, or Civ4, or Mass Effect, or Deus Ex, or BG&E, or Psychonauts...? I mean, okay, not all of them... but none of them? Really?

[self biased]

a few points i want to raise: advance wars is awesome in every respect. a good franchise as well as a great game. possibly the best game on their list. i find it curious that rock band gets the nod whilst guitar hero gets no mention when they were both pioneered from the same studio.

i'm also wondering about left 4 dead over halflife 2...

world of warcraft i'm okay with where it is. it certainly has been revolutionary in that it's largely destroyed every gaming group i've encountered that has been unfortunate enough to have two members playing...

i've never played bioshock. am i missing out? and where is civ 4 on this list?

[Asher]

Honestly, I've never liked HL2 and tried to play it so many times but stopped after a couple hours. I consider it massively overrated and incredibly boring.

Left 4 Dead / Left 4 Dead 2 definitely would be in my top 15 list. Both games gave me the most fun I've had playing video games in years. I spent all of tonight playing Left 4 Dead 2 with my SO and 2 friends from back home, and it was insane. Just an incredible game, they do so many things right. Very original.

[self biased]

no comment on the advance wars, though?

[Asher]

Never played it. I don't do mobile games.

[Jon Miller]

?? 15. SSX
14. The Sims
13. Ninja Gaiden
12. Braid
11. Advance Wars
10. Left 4 Dead
?? 9. Final Fantasy XII
8. Grand Theft Auto: Vice City
7. Ico
6. World of Warcraft
5. Portal
4. Rock Band
3. Fallout 3
2. Katamari Damacy
?? 1. BioShock

Was FFXII really that big? I thought it wasn't nearly as big as FFX, FFVII, or FFIII (US). Maybe I missed out on playing something amazing though.

SSX was good, I guess maybe it belongs. There were a lot of copy cats/etc.

I am guessing that Civ4 wasn't included because they were looking for 'new games'. Civ4 had been done before, but than so had FFXII (I think, maybe I should get it?).

I think that EVE should definitely be on the list.

JM

[DrSpike]

There are some really good games on the list. But yeah it's a bit random overall (particular number 14 is offensive to me ) with glaring omissions.

[Guynemer]

The problem is that they don't really define what they mean by "best". Most fun? Most culturally significant? Most innovative? Most immersive/artistically realized? Most staying power?

You could make a case for any of the above listed games fitting one of those categories; in a few rare cases, more than one (ie, Portal, or The Sims). But any number of games fit the bill better in nearly every instance; and, again, in some cases (HL2, Civ4), they fit the bill better in more than one category.

[Felch]

If you take a look at the comments you'll see a lot of people asking where either Civ4 or GalCiv2 is.

[Adagio]

So, your challenge--justify this list.

You can't do it, can you?

That's an impossible task

15. SSX
Haven't played it, but I have a hard time figuring out what can make a snowboarding game amazing enough to be on such list... but then I don't like snowboarding

14. The Sims
Hate it or love it, it's the best selling game series of all time. If the list is based on success, then this sure beats everything else

9. Final Fantasy XII
Considering that I hate fantasy, this one would of course never be on my favorite list. But from the sound of it, Final Fantasy games really has a lot of followers, so sounds fair enough that it's on the list (the series itself... can't comment on that exact release)

8. Grand Theft Auto: Vice City
IMHO they picked the worst of the GTA games released in the '00s. GTA3 or GTA:SA deserves that spot more than VC, at least those brought something new to the GTA universe

6. World of Warcraft
Same as FF. Can't stand the fantasy part, but it sure is a successful game with lots of followers, so yeah, belongs to the list

5. Portal
A game that brought something new to the gaming universe... an fps where it's not just about shooting your enemies with big guns, but about thinking your way to the exit

4. Rock Band
Never played it and probably never will... but isn't it just karaoke, using your guitar/drums instead of your singing?

3. Fallout 3
My favorite game that year, but it didn't really bring anything new to gaming

1. BioShock
IMHO the second worst game released that year. And from I can read around the web, it sounds like it's just a copy of a game released a long time ago, just with better graphics (and story wise it wasn't done as well as the original)

Then there's a lot of games on the list I've never heard about (or never cared to read more about), that I didn't comment. I can only justify a few of them

i've never played bioshock. am i missing out?

IMHO not at all. That game managed to grab everything I hate about FPS games and put it into the same game (bad weapons, fantasy weapons, boring zombie enemies, extremely easy enemies, you couldn't die at all, enemies put into obvious spots*, small areas, one-way-street, etc... could go on forever)

*you just picked up electricity and look over there a bunch of zombies standing in water

[Asher]

BioShock was way, way better than you give it credit for.