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Thread: New PBEM Classic SMAC

  1. #31
    St Jon
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    I meant only in terms of factions. Though my original intent had been a straight random launch from SMAC if we're using SMACX as the driver for the game I cannot see any reason to lose the benefits of the improved tech tree it offers.
    “Quid latine dictum sit, altum videtur”
    - Anon

  2. #32
    florin79c
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    A 5th player would make Vyeh start all over the scenario, but this is not the reson i'm against the 5th player. As you say, it's your first multy game and will be verry hard for you ajust. I sugest you try some TCP/IP games first so you can get use to the idea and il offer you your first game if interested.

  3. #33
    vyeh
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    The Vet's map would not be good for 5 players. I have no problems setting up the game for 4 or 5, but I need to know which one.

  4. #34
    St Jon
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    I agree and as I said extending 4 to 5 would be very much down to the additional work Vyeh would need to put in! He's doing us a favour as is it is and I don't want to ask more of him.

    In terms of PBEM I have not played for 5yrs or more but I did use to play frequently before so I reckon I can climb that learning curve. I would like to take you up on TCP/IP but I have not got the time to play IP at the moment.
    “Quid latine dictum sit, altum videtur”
    - Anon

  5. #35
    florin79c
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    the TCP/IP sugestion was for Ocker 3, but i can give you a try as well

  6. #36
    vyeh
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    My suggestion for moving things forward:

    (1) Everybody PM me their password for this game.
    (2) I need to know the faction that Ocker3 is playing and where he is in the turn order (he is either at the beginning or the end since he is in Australia).

  7. #37
    florin79c
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    I sugest he wont play.

  8. #38
    St Jon
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    I agree we stick to 4.
    “Quid latine dictum sit, altum videtur”
    - Anon

  9. #39
    vyeh
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    I received passwords from florin79c and zsozso.

  10. #40
    florin79c
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    I ques we go with multiplayer standard rules. Pls post them when the game is ready

  11. #41
    Mart
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ocker3 View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    I don't want to throw everything into confusion, but any chance I could get in on this action? This would be my first multi game though, so it might take me a bit to get up to speed, played the hell out of the game in single player mode. I'm in Australia, GMT +10, playing in the evenings here.
    Ocker,
    Start a new thread asking for players to join your new game. Also specify what would be your preferred settings, as someone starting a game you would have some advantage in shaping it.
    A good game is 3 or 4 human players.

    ----
    Regarding scenario done on mac - should work. Recently we have a tool modifying both SMAC and SMAX saves, I think single- and multiplayer also... (I don't remember details...) Converter is in my download area. There is a thread with link in Creation subsection.
    Mart
    Map creation contest
    WPC SMAC(X) Democracy Game - Morganities aspire to dominate Planet

  12. #42
    mmontgomery
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    Sorry to be so late chiming in. I have been travelling, and generally only checking my email, and not the boards.

    I have sent my password to Vyeh.

    The vets map as modified by Mart for balance is the most balanced map I have ever played on. I think it is usually labeled vets4, because it provides a balanced start for up to for players, and is also great for 2 teams of 2. So people don't have to figure this out the hard way, the size of the vets map permits 7 cities at 0 efficiency before extra drones start appearing.

    Vyeh, do you have the modified vets map? If not, I can send it to you if you send me your email address.

    I think the best start is something like 2 CP, 2 scout, 1 former, with the appropriate extras for Spartans and Angels.

    All of the settings are fine with me. I do strongly suggest that we ban copters and planet busters. With no AI, I normally suggest banning all attrocities, but with 3 AI players, there is sufficient disincentive to avoid overdoing attrocities.

    I have a long explanation of why copters are terribly unbalanced in another thread, and I can summarize here if anyone is unsure why copters should be banned.

    My email addresses are:
    michaelTAmontgoTODus
    mmontgomeryTAslbTODcom

    For fastest response, I need to have turns sent to both addresses.

    I am not worried about the Mac issue; I know how to handle it. If you want, you can send me the Mac turns.

    The vets map is only balanced for 4 players. I have also noticed games tend to bog down badly after 4 players. So better to start another 4 player game.

    I look forward to our game!

  13. #43
    vyeh
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    I got the map, labeled Veterans_04.mp from a thread you are familiar with.

    I was thinking of 3 CP's, 3 scouts.

    I can give you formers, but would modify the alphax.txt file so these formers cannot be reversed engineered.

    Are there any other requests?

    Do you mean ban copters and planet busters entirely? (I assume I can disable the chassis and planetbuster weapon backage. Maybe Mart can advise if he happens to be reading whether there is a problem.)

    Only the first person to play needs to run my scenario through the converter. (It may not be necessary for that person to be a player, if someone takes my posted scenario, runs it through the converter and posts the converted file.) You've played with Bodissey and I even read of one person who didn't need to convert so this is not an issue.)

    Issues:

    (1) Starting units (basically what mmontgomery wants; could give supply droids that can't be backward engineered for even faster start).

    (2) Any requests about starting locations (again mmontgomery might have favorite square; this would apply to all players for symmetrical start).

    (3) Banning copters and planet busters (anyone object to total ban).

    Since I'll be using the modified veteran's map, this should be quick.

    I'll test to be sure mmontgomery can choose all techs first turn as Uni (let me know if someone else took Unit) and whether any AI looks overpowered.

    I plan to force difficulty as Mart would. Is there anything else (if Mart is reading) I should be aware of?
    Last edited by vyeh; February 21, 2009 at 12:18.

  14. #44
    vyeh
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    Please review.

    Wealth of Planet - PBEM game
    SMAX Game
    Code:
    Factions:
    
    Hive		florin79c	-florin79cTAhotmailTODcom	
    Morganities	FriendlyFire	-jonathan.furdererTAliveTODcoTODuk
    University	mmontgomery	-michaelTAmontgoTODus	
    Gaians		zsozso		-zsoltTAsimbiosysTODca		
    Spartans	AI
    Believers	AI
    PK		AI
    
    CMN		vyeh		-Apolyton PM
    ______________________________________
    Preference	|	Veterans_04 map
    
    Map size	|	Custom, 50x100
    Ocean		|	50-70%
    Erosion		|	Average	
    Life		|	Average
    Clouds		|	Average
    Difficulty	|	Transcend
    
    Transcend	|	Yes
    Conquest	|	Yes
    Diplomatic	|	Yes
    Economic	|	Yes
    Cooperative	|	Yes
    Do or Die	|	Yes	
    Flexible start	|	Yes
    Tech stag	|	No	
    Spoils of war	|	No
    Blind research	|	No
    Intense riv	|	No
    No survey	|	Yes
    No scatter	|	Yes
    No rnd events	|	Yes
    Time Warp	|	No
    Iron man	|	No
    Rand person	|	No
    Rand social	|	No
    Rules:
    • A player may not restart a turn without good reason. The player should specify the reason in the game thread if he was not able to avoid reloading the turn. (Obviously, if a player has suffered some sort of crash during a turn, such a reload is unavoidable)
    • If a player performs a probe team action other than to infiltrate against another player with whom (s)he is in a truce, treaty or pact, they must inform the probed player what it was they did and what they stole/sabotaged. They must also choose the 'declare vendetta/cancel pact' option when they perform the action.
    • A player is not permitted to make more than one social engineering change per line, per turn. For instance, one is not permitted to start the turn in wealth, switch to power mid-turn for the extra disbanded minerals, and then switch back to wealth that same turn, getting the refund.
    • A player is not permitted to use the 'demand withdrawal' feature against another player, leaving the AI the decision of whether to withdraw or not.
    • A player may not accept a bribe from another player's AI during council sessions.
    • A player may not perform multiple airdrops in a single turn with the same unit using the right-click menu.
    • A player may not use the F4 screen when infiltrated to change an opponent's workers to specialists.
    • Council notification - immediate broadcast to all players(Post in the thread and e-mail to all immediately by player who has called elections, citing candidates and votes. After each player's turn, post in the thread the running totals).
    • If a player declares vendetta upon another player, either directly or indirectly, they must not accept a pending diplomatic agreement between the two factions in the same turn.
    • A player may not make air drops using the right click "air drop to" function, when it is not possible to do so with the "i" button, ie. after already having moved or made a drop.
    • A player may not use build queue manipulation or other loopholes to hurry production at a cost that would be lower than directly hurrying the item that one intends to build.
    • A player may not use build queue manipulation or other loopholes to build something you could not directly add to the build queue.
    • A player may not upgrade a particular type of unit using the design workshop, and then attack with that unit in the same turn.
    • Copters are banned from the game.
    • Secret projects may be hurried with crawlers.
    • Copters and planetbusters are banned.
    • Players and AIs start with 3 CP's, 3 scouts and 3 formers, with recon rover for Spartans.

    Notes:
    • Please consider whether you want 3 crawlers to start.
    Last edited by vyeh; February 21, 2009 at 12:25.

  15. #45
    mmontgomery
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    Yes, the veterans_04.mp was exactly what I had in mind. All players should take the map and load it into Alpha Centauri so that you can see exactly the terrain and features of the map, so we all start with the knowledge of the map. Otherwise, players who are already experienced with this map would have an advantage.

    I strongly suggest that we do not have any crawlers to start because of the secret projects. (I have heard of special crawlers designed that can only be cashed for 1 resource, and that would be OK, but I don't think we really need them.)

    I am used to a poorer start (2 CP, 2 scout, 1 former), but I have no problem starting with 3 of each if everyone wants that.

  16. #46
    vyeh
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    Let's go with mmontgomery. No crawlers, 2 CP, 2 scout, 1 former unless someone objects.

    FYI, Mart designed crawler droids that can be cashed in for 1 row of minerals.

    Please review rules carefully. I copied them and have no particular attachment.

    I'd like to hear from anyone objecting to banning copters and planetbusters.

    Note that the stockpile energy bug was not addressed in the rules I copied.

    I would like to know if mmontgomery has a favorite starting location. (Vet's map is symmetrical; everybody will get a symmetric start.)

    Are there any other requests?

    Edit: I will add this to the notes: florin79c will have to convert the scenario posted by the CMN.
    Last edited by vyeh; February 21, 2009 at 12:43.

  17. #47
    mmontgomery
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    I think the intended starting location is the spot of jungle just at the top of the bit of road. Of course, players can always move the CPs from there to anywhere they want.

  18. #48
    zsozso
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    I understand that the multi-attack feature makes the copters way too powerful. However, complete ban of the copter chassis seems too harsh to me. There are other nice advantages (e.g. long range with 3 crash-landings) which can allow long-range scouting, air-transport usage etc. Isn't there a way to disable multi-attack via alphax.txt and allow copters that way ? I would prefer that solution.
    Last edited by zsozso; February 21, 2009 at 21:20. Reason: typo
    ::Zsozso::

  19. #49
    vyeh
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    I believe multi-attack is part of the characteristic of the chassis (just like speeders and hovertanks can make multiple attacks). There are no flags in alphax.txt to disable multiple attacks.

  20. #50
    vyeh
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    I have run into a slight glitch. I am following Googlie's procedure and I have come to the following paragraph:

    "If the University is one of the factions, you will either need to set the mission year to 2100 (thus the turn you “play” will be 2100, and the send to the first player is actually 2101, thus giving the UoP player his choice of a free tech) or find out in advance what he wants as a free tech and give it through the scenario/edit tech process. Be careful that you don’t end up giving 2 techs plus a free tech as well. Trial and error a couple of times is often needed to get this one right."

    I seem unable to set the mission year to 2100. When I go in and try, it ends up as 2101. Obviously, mmontgomery could PM me with his choice of tech, but I'd like to PM Mart and Darsnan.

  21. #51
    florin79c
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    Do so

  22. #52
    vyeh
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    I got passed the glitch. Ironically, when you try to set the mission year to 2100, the application sets it to 2101. If you leave it alone, it remains at 2100.

  23. #53
    vyeh
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    Game has started.

    These are the only differences from SMAX with SMAC 7 factions:

    (1) All factions, including AI, start with an extra colony pod, scout and former.

    (2) Map is veterans map modified by Mart.

    (3) No planetbusters.

    (4) No copters.

    Because this is a custom map, the number of minerals or nutrients in a row will look like a standard game.

    I set up a turn tracking thread (TTT). Please use this thread, not the TTT, to report any problems. In testing, I noticed a problem with missing techs. Mart reported that this is a known problem with no solutions.

    If this is a problem for anyone, we can restart the game and I will select the tech of your choice. (Now that I figured out the perverse effect of setting mission year in my Mac software, I can restart the game in about half an hour.)

  24. #54
    St Jon
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    Quote Originally Posted by vyeh View Post
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    Game has started.

    I set up a turn tracking thread (TTT). Please use this thread, not the TTT, to report any problems. In testing, I noticed a problem with missing techs. Mart reported that this is a known problem with no solutions.

    If this is a problem for anyone, we can restart the game and I will select the tech of your choice. (Now that I figured out the perverse effect of setting mission year in my Mac software, I can restart the game in about half an hour.)
    Thanks, for all your work Vyeh it is much appreciated. I do have a query over the 'missing techs'. Do you mean that Factions are launching without their default starting Tech or that we have a situation where the Tech tree itself is missing a bunch of Techs? The 2 situations would be very different in so far as it will disadvantage us all at the beginning but not, at least for me, be critical however when plotting my developement I would find it very frustrating if a pivitol Tech I had been working towards were simply not be there. Obviously it would be different for us all as to which Techs were missing and perhaps much more frustrating for the Gaians to find they started without Centauri Ecology than for Morgan to have to research Industrial Economics at the start.
    “Quid latine dictum sit, altum videtur”
    - Anon

  25. #55
    vyeh
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    You all should have the correct starting tech since I put it in myself and checked to see that it was there.

    What Mart reported was that in a multiplayer game, the Hive did not get the option to choose Centauri Ecology as its first tech to research. He had to give the Hive the tech to research. After you have researched the first tech, you will get to choose your techs subject to the modulo 3 feature.

    The missing tech is only from your first tech choice. After that, the missing tech will be available later as normal.

    I only raised the point because I had been reading mmontgomery's issues with being "sidetracked" in another game and I was deliberately looking at his tech choices and noticed a tech missing.

    A little research showed that it was known. It may be that no one wants a tech that is missing.

    Edit: I gather from the TTT that there was no problem using the Mac to Win converter.
    Last edited by vyeh; February 22, 2009 at 09:49.

  26. #56
    florin79c
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    No problem there and i could pick Centauri Ecology so we are good


    Thx

  27. #57
    vyeh
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    It wasn't the Hive this time. The problem probably has to do with slot assignments.

  28. #58
    mmontgomery
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    The one game I got sidetracked I knew something was wrong from the first turn since I could not pick Planetary Networks. As soon as I get this turn, I will know and report.

    Out of half a dozen games played on the modified vets map, I have only seen the tech sidetracking once.

    Who has the turn right now?

  29. #59
    mmontgomery
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    OK, University is definitely sidetracked. I was not able to pick Planetary Networks as either my free pick or as my first tech pick. Can we fix this and restart? It may mean that my faction has to be moved to a different slot. If so, this is OK.

  30. #60
    vyeh
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    That was my experience in testing. I used the tech predictor. You can get to IA with the current slot position by choosing IB as your free pick, then IE, then PN and finally IA, so I did not see it as a sidetrack.

    If you want a restart, do I switch you with slot #2 (FriendlyFire) or with slot #4 (zsozso)?

    It looks like you and FriendlyFire have the same local time.

    I'm going to switch the two of you.
    Last edited by vyeh; February 23, 2009 at 08:04.

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