CTP Challenge Ladder -- February 2011

[ricketyclik]

And, how do you start both players on turn 0, as the creator gets a turn immediately.

[Maquiladora]

And, how do you start both players on turn 0, as the creator gets a turn immediately.

When I did it I just saved the game manually before playing my first turn. That way I could send my opponent his player 1 and player 2 turn 0 saves.

[quinns]

That's how I did it too, Maq.

And yes, Maquiladora, it can get confusing. You just have to be careful with saving your turns. I think dual-duel is still the fairest and best way to play a match though, even better than using symmetrical maps. On symmetrical maps, some people practice and practice on the map before actually playing the game... so they already know the map inside and out. In a dual-duel match the map is always a mystery.

[quinns]

Just to clarify the Dual-Duel method of starting:

1. Start a two human player (blue and orange for example) PBEM game with any settings you like.
2. The creator of the game does not play his first turn but instead just ends the turn.
3. The creator then opens the orange turn 0 that was just saved to his desktop, plays that turn, and ends it creating the blue turn 1 on his desktop.
4. The creator then sends to his oppenent the orange turn 0 and the blue turn 1 to his opponent.
5. The opponent opens each turn and plays it, then sends to the creator the blue turn 1 and the orange turn 1.
6. Repeat until one player wins either game. The first winner wins the match.

[Maquiladora]

Just to clarify the Dual-Duel method of starting:

1. Start a two human player (blue and orange for example) PBEM game with any settings you like.
2. The creator of the game does not play his first turn but instead just ends the turn.
3. The creator then opens the orange turn 0 that was just saved to his desktop, plays that turn, and ends it creating the blue turn 1 on his desktop.
4. The creator then sends to his oppenent the orange turn 0 and the blue turn 1 to his opponent.
5. The opponent opens each turn and plays it, then sends to the creator the blue turn 1 and the orange turn 1.
6. Repeat until one player wins either game. The first winner wins the match.

That's a little different to how I did. I saved it in-game (options > save) before I played my player 1 turn 0, then I went to the folder (\ctp_program\ctp\save\games\...) and sent that save, along with the turned I just played which is on the desktop. The manually saved file is a little bigger to send, but it continues as a normal PBEM save once the other player plays it.

I wish there was a way to change the names in a started game, that way you could have both player/email names be different for each game, to avoid confusion.

Another thing is obviously you already know where your opponent is, so it takes away some of the tension and mystery in exploring. Although it does add a different kind of mind games.

Perhaps a symmetrical (or just somewhat fair) map could be made by a third party, so both players don't have a chance to practice the map. But frankly it's a bit too much fuss.

I still prefer a normal random game, play the hand you're dealt an all that.

[ricketyclik]

I still prefer a normal random game, play the hand you're dealt an all that.

I agree.

[thehappies]

I still prefer a normal random game, play the hand you're dealt an all that.

Yes, that way I can say "Maq is beating me because he got a better starting spot" and "I'm going to KILL him next time when I get good spot!" Keep the hope burning bright!

[quinns]

Yes, that way I can say "Maq is beating me because he got a better starting spot" and "I'm going to KILL him next time when I get good spot!" Keep the hope burning bright!

Yes. Good points. But there are so many games that can always be blamed on bad land. It is a waste of time sometimes. Somebody once had some map settings that almost always gave both the blue and the orange player a river in forest as a starting point. But I can't remember what they were... something about the land being very hot and very wet.

[Maquiladora]

Yes, that way I can say "Maq is beating me because he got a better starting spot" and "I'm going to KILL him next time when I get good spot!" Keep the hope burning bright!

Always a useful backup.

[thehappies]

Always a useful backup.

Not that I even had a bad starting spot . . . I just always like to have a ready excuse. Because we all know I NEVER make tactical errors . ..

[Grandpa Troll]

Not that I even had a bad starting spot . . . I just always like to have a ready excuse. Because we all know I NEVER make tactical errors . ..

Your correct sir

The one you hadnt made with me is not playing me, because if you did............

[Maquiladora]

Not that I even had a bad starting spot . . . I just always like to have a ready excuse. Because we all know I NEVER make tactical errors . ..

You've made good moves all game, always keeping me on the defensive. It was just the science lead that changed the balance.

I have another surprise soon though (I realise saying this will make it less of a surprise now)

[thehappies]

You've made good moves all game, always keeping me on the defensive. It was just the science lead that changed the balance.

I have another surprise soon though (I realise saying this will make it less of a surprise now)

I think my biggest bad move was not colonizing the mountains to your north before you did. That place has been pumping out misery for me for a long time now.

And if your surprise happens to involve a mushroom cloud . . .

[Maquiladora]

And if your surprise happens to involve a mushroom cloud . . .

A little less dramatic than that, but it should sweep out those SOL's on that inner sea.

I think we said no nukes this game anyway?

Edit: Yeah back on turn 97 we agreed no nukes or wonders.

BTW what is the rule on capturing AI wonders in PBEM games? I mean you can't sell them, and you have a massive advantage if you happen to be closer to an AI that builds most of the wonders.

[thehappies]

BTW what is the rule on capturing AI wonders in PBEM games? I mean you can't sell them, and you have a massive advantage if you happen to be closer to an AI that builds most of the wonders.

If the wonders are obsolete, it obviously doesn't matter. If they are 'wonders of little use', I don't usually worry about it. If they are something more dramatic though, you should a)not take over that city, b) destroy the city, c)disband/starve the city if it is possible to do so quickly d) let the AI have the city back.

[Maquiladora]

If the wonders are obsolete, it obviously doesn't matter. If they are 'wonders of little use', I don't usually worry about it. If they are something more dramatic though, you should a)not take over that city, b) destroy the city, c)disband/starve the city if it is possible to do so quickly d) let the AI have the city back.

Perhaps this should be in the rules. Like no capturing of an AI city with a wonder that isn't obsolete?

[thehappies]

New year, time for new challenges: I challenge PrinceBolkonsky and EPW, who are both within the three steps up range from my ladder position.

Hatschy, did you ever get any takers on your challenges? If not, I have room for another game. Have we ever played in a 1 v 1? I don't think so, or else it's been so long I can't remember.

[TheBirdMan]

Yes. Good points. But there are so many games that can always be blamed on bad land. It is a waste of time sometimes. Somebody once had some map settings that almost always gave both the blue and the orange player a river in forest as a starting point. But I can't remember what they were... something about the land being very hot and very wet.

I have told you (not you personal Steve , but in gereral) before - now I'm doing it again.

If you chose 100% for diversity, then NO-ONE gets a real bad starting position....... Dull, slow, not good - yes to that. But you will never be "left alone" in a waste area of the same kind of useless kind of land.

[TheBirdMan]

Yes. Good points. But there are so many games that can always be blamed on bad land. It is a waste of time sometimes. Somebody once had some map settings that almost always gave both the blue and the orange player a river in forest as a starting point. But I can't remember what they were... something about the land being very hot and very wet.

185. quinns def TheBirdMan; Started Nov 2008; Finished Jan 2009; Turns 39



Actually, TheBirdMan had some bad land so he conceded at turn 39. So we swapped sides with the same map to see if I could do any better. My number two spot may be very short-lived!

Well I have played the map my way until now - but if you want it finished, then...... I know where you live

[thehappies]

And what's the whole deal about how game setup tends to give a better starting spot to certain colors?

Is it blue and green that tend to have the better starting spots? That's something to keep in mind for team games because two 'slightly better' starting spots adds up a sizeable advantage.

I had never thought of the diverse landscape helping to equalize starting point advantages, but it makes sense.

The best is when you both get super crappy starting points. Cuaich and I played a game where we were both up against the polar ice cap in a non-donut world and the AIs were beating us up pretty majorly for a while before we were able to get things under control. We kept joking because when we'd send turns to each other, I'd keep seeing that he was being harassed by slavers and clerics and he would see the tell-tale skull from my cities being destroyed by the rampaging AI. But since we both started pretty bad, it still turned out an even game.

I kind of like having to deal with the 'luck of the draw' as far as where you are started off.

[Maquiladora]

The best is when you both get super crappy starting points.

I agree, it's a good leveler, requires more thought too. Alligator monopoly

[hatschy]

Hatschy, did you ever get any takers on your challenges? If not, I have room for another game. Have we ever played in a 1 v 1? I don't think so, or else it's been so long I can't remember.

I can't remember one either. I accept your challenge, just set up a game and send it to hlern(at)gmx(dot)at. Use whatever settings you like. I'd like to play Welsh, please.

As for PrinceBolkonsky and EPW, maybe they should be moved from the ladder to the other list.

[thehappies]

I can't remember one either. I accept your challenge, just set up a game and send it to hlern(at)gmx(dot)at. Use whatever settings you like. I'd like to play Welsh, please.

Challenge match started hatschy vs. thehappies!

Conditions are:

Pollution on
CTP PBEM Mod Lite--on (if you aren't familiar with this mod, let me know)
Landscape conditions: all 50% except diversity at 100%
Map size: regular
Earth world (not donut world)
2 AI civs
Diety level

And, if you agree, we'll outlaw nukes and wonders.

[thehappies]

184. Maquiladora def. thehappies; Started Nov 2008-Finished Jan 2009 Turn 159

We were pretty much neck and neck for about half the game. Then he used a spy to make one of my cities revolt and little by little his navy got the upper hand and he got ahead of me in science while I wasn't paying attention. Then it was about 30 or 40 turns of just plain stubborness before I finally conceded. Good game.

[quinns]

203. hatschy vs thehappies; Started Jan 2009

Maquiladora takes over 4th place after defeating TheHappies. Congratulations Maq!

[Maquiladora]

184. Maquiladora def. thehappies; Started Nov 2008-Finished Jan 2009 Turn 159

We were pretty much neck and neck for about half the game. Then he used a spy to make one of my cities revolt and little by little his navy got the upper hand and he got ahead of me in science while I wasn't paying attention. Then it was about 30 or 40 turns of just plain stubborness before I finally conceded. Good game.

I was hardly on the offensive most of the game, of course I had a few good counter-punches though.

Anyway good game!

Maquiladora takes over 4th place after defeating TheHappies. Congratulations Maq!

Thanks! I'll think about a new challenge today...

[Maquiladora]

OK I challenge dancemasseuse, if I may. I'll fire off an email to him in a while.

BTW quinns my nationality is GBR Kind of annoying that they removed the flags from the forum.

[quinns]

I wonder where I got Mexico as your nationality... I guess from Maquiladora. Anyway, I corrected it on the ladder

[quinns]

183. quinns def hornedfrog; Started Nov 2008; Finished Feb 2009; Turns 59

Good game, Ken. Full bore early Knight attack -- luckily worked this time. If it didn't I would have been in bad shape.

[quinns]

*** Request filed by iDestroy to move PrinceBolkonsky to Alternate CTP PBEM Players list ***

If we don't hear from PrinceBolkonsky on this thread within 30 days of this notice, then he will be moved off the ladder and into the Alternate Players list. (This will be the standard way of removing an inactive player from the ladder.)

PrinceBolkonsky moved to Alternate list.