Finally time to get a new computer

Guynemer · October 30, 2008, 08:24

I decided long ago to keep my current computer until a game I really wanted came out and I wouldn't be able to run it. I made it almost six years, but Can You Run It? tells me that no, in fact, I can't even come close to running Fallout 3.

I know very little about computer technology in general. What I'd like it a new computer that will last another 5-6 years based on my "new game" criterion. I'd like to spend as little as possible without actually physically assembling the mother****er myself. I'm still using the same monitor I got with my last computer, so it's about 10 years old, and still kickin' it, but I think I'd like a new monitor too.

So, where should I go to order it? Who is the most reliable? What sort of components should I get as far as processors, video cards, etc.?

snoopy369 · October 30, 2008, 10:27

So you don't want to build it yourself? Most of us here will suggest you do just that, but that's up to you

CPU: Get either a E7400+ or a Q6600+, make sure it's 45nm (like a Wolfdale, for example).

Video card: IIRC the best current video card p/p is the ATI HD4850 or 4870 (a bit under $200 and $300 respectively). If you want cheaper than that, go with a 8800GTS or whichever of those 8800s is the best right now (too many **** letters to remember).

Memory: 4GB. You're probably best off buying this yourself no matter what - get a computer with any given amount of RAM and get your own to push it up to 4GB. You'll be stuck with Vista I think if you buy a retail box, so you might as well get enough RAM for it.

HDD: again, I'd buy this yourself regardless. Get a Tower that has plenty of space for upgraded HDDs, and then buy a 500GB or bigger drive to add to whatever it comes with - they're dirt cheap nowadays.

Guynemer · October 30, 2008, 12:19

Don't know how to build it myself, snoop. Wish I did.

Asher · October 30, 2008, 12:31

Originally posted by Guynemer
Don't know how to build it myself, snoop. Wish I did.

It's honestly so easy, a Doctor could do it.

Things only go in one way, there's not that many parts. If you can use a screwdriver you can build a computer.

But if you're uncomfortable doing it, then buying it assembled is certainly an option...

Where do you live (city-wise) these days?

Aeson · October 30, 2008, 12:57

I don't know much about retail computer suppliers. As for what specs you should look to get...

I think given your criteria you would probably be best suited to go with a 8800GT 512MB (also 9800GT 512MB is almost identical) and expect to upgrade the video card whenever the next "must have" video game comes out after 2+ years. Since you made it 6 years on the last one, I wouldn't put the money in until it's necessary. A 8800GT will run most games out now and in the near future well enough (not at max settings, but it's going to run the games), and is cheap too. Replacing a video card is easy, and PCI-e (2.0) should be here to stay for quite some time yet. (Newegg has a 8800GT 512MB for $115 after MIR. In a couple years you upgrade to another low $100s video card and probably end up with a better card in years 2-6 or whatever than if you buy a $200-$300 card now.)

E8400 is perhaps the right CPU, though it's getting iffy. Mainly because there isn't going to be as good an upgrade path for CPUs since Intel is changing their socket. You could pick up one of the 45nm quad cores eventually when they come down in price, but I think you end up paying more for less in the long run that way. A Q9550 is probably the best bet right now if you want several years without upgrading the entire rig (and OC'ing is not an option).

Though if you're buying a computer whole, that config may or may not be available or cost effective. If you do find the seller you want to use, let us know and we can look through the options to see which is the best deal that will suit your criteria.

I think Arrian used IBuyPower, which seemed reasonable at the time. Not sure how that worked out for him. Could ask him how his experience was.

snoopy369 · October 30, 2008, 14:29

Originally posted by Guynemer
Don't know how to build it myself, snoop. Wish I did.

1. Buy parts (have Aeson or I tell you what to buy)
2. Plug them together
3. Profit!

The only hard part is getting the wires to appropriately fit into the case without being in the way of each other. That's really it ...

It's too bad you don't live in or around Chicago, I could do the work for (with) you then

Zopperoni · October 30, 2008, 15:20

There are only five or six wires that will run across the motherboard: case fan power, harddisk power, harddisk ATA, CPU power, motherboard power, and GPU power. The rest, including the DVD power and the DVD ATA can be rerouted to the optical drive bays; I stash the unnecessary cables away in a vacant drive bay.

The ASUS P5KC has one of the best layouts I've seen for effective cable management.

Nostromo · October 30, 2008, 16:46

From my, admittedly limited, experience, you don't save that much money by building it yourself. And its a waste of time, IMO.

For the graphics card, I'd get a Radeon 4850. It got great reviews. The best one around seems to be the Sapphire Toxic HD 4850 512MB GDDR3. Its a bit more expensive, but it has better cooling. The 8800 GT is soooooo old.

Guynemer · October 30, 2008, 20:30

Originally posted by Asher
Where do you live (city-wise) these days?

I live in the home of Rick Nash and the mighty Blue Jackets.

Thanks for the advice guys... I have tomorrow morning off, and I'll do some investigating... keep it coming!

Krill · October 30, 2008, 21:17

Depending on how much you download, you wont really need more than a 500 gigabyte HD, a good 500watt PS (Corsair HX?) will power everything, might not even teh 500W PS, though it is a good one at a decent price, and don't ever, ever forget, you'll need a DVD drive.

Krill · October 30, 2008, 21:20

Originally posted by Guynemer

I live in the home of Rick Nash and the mighty Blue Jackets.

Thanks for the advice guys... I have tomorrow morning off, and I'll do some investigating... keep it coming!

[BRIT]Oregon[/BRIT]

Asher · October 31, 2008, 01:03

So you're in the legendary city of Columbus.

Google around for some local computer shops, they will assemble your computer for you from parts:

http://www.microcenter.com/search/se...up=pc_desktops

http://www.columbusmicro.com/

http://www.krazy-kenny.com/

KrazyHorse · October 31, 2008, 09:01

Originally posted by Guynemer

I live in the home of Rick Nash and the mighty Blue Jackets.

O-H!

KrazyHorse · October 31, 2008, 09:01

Ann Arbor is a whore.

snoopy369 · October 31, 2008, 10:25

Some Microcenters are good, some aren't, just depending on the staffing...

Guynemer · October 31, 2008, 10:38

Originally posted by KrazyHorse
O-H!

Ann Arbor is a whore.

Look, isn't dealing with how bad Michigan is this year while living in frikken Columbus enough? Must even the Canucks pour it on?

KrazyHorse · October 31, 2008, 10:45

HAAAAAAAANNNG ON SLOOPY, SLOOPY HANG ON!

snoopy369 · October 31, 2008, 10:48

Isn't it a bit early for you to be this drunk, KH?

KrazyHorse · October 31, 2008, 10:50

I wish I was.

Guynemer · October 31, 2008, 11:22

Originally posted by snoopy369
CPU: Get either a E7400+ or a Q6600+, make sure it's 45nm (like a Wolfdale, for example).

Don't really know what this means, to be honest.

Asher · October 31, 2008, 11:25

It's the size of the transistors ( 45nm = 45 nanometer). 45nm is the latest and greatest, they're smaller processors that run cooler.

It's not really that big a deal, just google the model number or ask here and it can be discovered if it's an older 65nm or a newer 45nm.

Wolfdale is just the codename for the 45nm version of the chip.

KrazyHorse · October 31, 2008, 11:31

What scale do they anticipate quantum tunneling effects to become prohibitive at, given current design paths?

Asher · October 31, 2008, 11:34

No idea. They probably don't know either.

Every generation they shrink and they say "the next one will be the limit", then they have some breakthrough and it gets one more step.

I think now they are using Extreme Ultraviolet Lithography. Don't know much other than that : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Extreme...et_lithography

Guynemer · October 31, 2008, 11:43

Okay, just messing around on Dell, here's something I put together:

SYSTEM COLOR Aluminum with Clearcoat Chassis edit
PROCESSOR Intel® Core™2 Q9550 (12MB,2.83GHz, 1333FSB)
OPERATING SYSTEM Genuine Windows Vista® Home Premium
MEMORY 4GB Dual Channel DDR3 SDRAM at 1333MHz - 4 DIMMs
VIDEO CARD DUAL CARDS: ATI Radeon HD4850 512MB GDDR4
HARD DRIVE 500GB - 7200RPM, SATA 3.0Gb/s, 16MB Cache
OPTICAL DRIVE Dual Drives: 16x DVD-ROM Drive + 16x DVD+/-RW w/ dbl layer write capable
MONITOR Dell S2409W 24" Full HD Widescreen Flat Panel Monitor
SOUND CARD Integrated 7.1 Channel Audio
SPEAKERS No speakers (Speakers are required to hear audio from your system) (I already have speakers)
KEYBOARD Dell USB Enhanced Multimedia Keyboard
MOUSE Dell Premium Optical USB Mouse
FLOPPY & MEDIA READER Dell 19 in 1 Media Reader with Bluetooth
My Software & Accessories
ANTI-VIRUS & SECURITY Norton Internet Security 2008, 15-Month
PRODUCTIVITY Microsoft® Office Home and Student 2007
PRINTER Dell AIO 948 (PRODUCT) RED - Includes Fax
PRINTER CABLE Dell 10ft USB Printer Cable
SERVICE & SUPPORT 1Yr Ltd. Warranty, 1 yr HW Warranty Support, 1 yr Advance Exchange
DELL 948 (PRODUCT) RED Dell 948 All In One (PRODUCT) RED™
My Service
WARRANTY AND SERVICE 1Yr Ltd Hardware Warranty, InHome Service after Remote Diagnosis
DATASAFE ONLINE BACKUP Dell Online Backup 2GB for 1 year
ENVIRONMENTAL OPTIONS Recycling Kit and Plant a Tree for Me
ALSO INCLUDED WITH YOUR SYSTEM
MODEM No Modem Requested
Cooling Option Copper base Heat Sink with aluminum fins
Adobe Software Adobe® Acrobat® Reader 9.0 Multi-Language
Dell Digital Entertainment No Entertainment software pre-installed
Labels Windows Vista™ Premium
XPS Specialized Support XPS, Specialized Support

The damage for all this is $2900.

KrazyHorse · October 31, 2008, 11:53

Originally posted by Asher
No idea. They probably don't know either.

Every generation they shrink and they say "the next one will be the limit", then they have some breakthrough and it gets one more step.

I think now they are using Extreme Ultraviolet Lithography. Don't know much other than that : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Extreme...et_lithography

Not talking about the actual manufacturing process. There should be a scale limit at which the probability of current tunneling between transistors in the CPU rapidly increases (to a good approximation the tunneling probability is exponentially dependent on the transistor size, i.e. the width of the tunneling barrier). They can reduce this effect somewhat with better dielectrics, but when you put an exponential (processor size) inside another exponential (tunneling equation) bad things cannot be far behind...

Asher · October 31, 2008, 12:00

I don't know anything about that, it's not really software related.

I imagine they don't really know these things until they get there. They thought they had more room in the GHz spectrum for ships (that's why they did the whole Pentium 4 fiasco) and they didn't. There was weird interference they didn't anticipate, excessive heat they didn't anticipate, etc.

Again, not really what you're talking about, but from what I know they don't seem to know the limits until they hit them.

KrazyHorse · October 31, 2008, 12:06

I know it's not your area of expertise. Was just hoping to get an answer, because when I ask that of EEs they get squirrelly.

bantams · October 31, 2008, 12:11

id go for the dell xps 420 q6600 (like mine) or higher xps version with better graphics geforce 8800 gtx pro and 4gb ram maybe

Guynemer · October 31, 2008, 12:25

I could easily knock a few hundred off that total by finding a monitor elsewhere... does that price seem reasonable for that build, and how long would you guys think it would last?

Asher · October 31, 2008, 12:44

The XPS line usually has a price premium...I'd try to get more than 512MB of RAM if possible on the graphics card too. That matters more and more now, especially as new tasks like Physics get offloaded to the GPUs in addition to graphics.