Jan III Sobieski scenario

[GhostOfDisco]

Double post (see previous page).

[McMonkey]

Excellent work!

[GhostOfDisco]

Yet another preview: the Brandenburg Curiasser:

[GhostOfDisco]

And here's the improved Brandenberg musketeer and curiasser (at least I think they're improved. You opnion my differ.)

And I've got the Russian army laid out. Now I just need to get the Brandenberg, Ottoman, Swedish, and Imperial forces figured out!

[MacGalleo]

Good job, I look forward to seeing that scenario.

[GhostOfDisco]

Hmmm, I worked up these events to try to make it so that the Tartars cannot negotiate (with the Poles, but it seems to be required to be everybody) until the city of Chigirin is taken. However, it does not seem to work (when I begin the scen as the Poles, when the Tartars march up to my cities they ask for negotiations.

@IF
Negotiation
talkermask=0b01100000000000000000000000000110
listenermask=0b01100000000000000000000000000110
@THEN
@ENDIF

@IF
CityTaken
city=Chigirin
attacker=Anybody
defender=Crimean Tartars
@THEN
JUSTONCE
Negotiator
who=Crimean Tartars
type=Listener
state=Clear
@ENDIF

@IF
CityTaken
city=Chigirin
attacker=Anybody
defender=Crimean Tartars
@THEN
JUSTONCE
Negotiator
who=Crimean Tartars
type=Talker
state=Clear
@ENDIF
@ENDEVENTS

What do I need to change to get my desired effect? Anyone have any advice on this?

[EZRhino]

Have you delevented' the save?

[GhostOfDisco]

Well, the problem occurs when I load up a test .scn file, which I think should not be bound by the .sav's rules fix...

[EZRhino]

Same rules apply to .scns as far as I know...

[GhostOfDisco]

Can anyone help me with Swedish uniforms? I found this site, but it's Swedish and autotranslation sites are working worse than usual.

Though, counting the regiments, it seems that the most common uniform color was the grey coat, and the most common facing was red. Which would make them very similar in color to the Danish cavalry.

I also found a pic of a Swedish dragoon that was purpoted to be from the late 1600s (after the TYW), but it looked too much like a Great Northern War guy, and was on a general purpose site, not a specialty page...

[GhostOfDisco]

Well, I used DELEVENT on both the .sav on which I work on the scen and the test .scn file itself. Fired up ToT, started the test scenario (on "Deus" level) and the Tartars asked to negotiate first chance they got.

I'm wondering just how I'm supposed to get what I want- the Tartars unable to negotiate until the lose the city of Chigirin. And that whole Negotiation/-ior mask how does that work - especially since there aren't 32 civs in Civ II. To aid in one's assistance (should one decide to assist me in this, here are the civs in Sobieski's rules.txt file:

@LEADERS
Caesar, Livia, 0, 1, 1, Romans, Roman, 0, 1, 1, 1, Dictator, Dictator, 2, Imperator, Imperatrix
Adil Giray, Adil Giray, 0, 2, 2, Crimean Tartars,Tartar, 1, 1, -1, 1, Khan, Khan, 2, Khan, Khan, 4, Khan, Khan
Frederick William,Frederick William,0,3, 3, House of Brandenburg,Brandenburg,-1, 1, -1, 2, Elector, Electress, 4, Archbishop, Archbishop, 6, Chancellor, Chancellor
Ramesses, Cleopatra, 0, 4, 0, Egyptians, Egyptian, 0, 0, 1, 1, Pharaoh, Pharaoh, 2, Great Pharaoh, Great Pharaoh
Abe Lincoln, E. Roosevelt, 0, 5, 1, Americans, American, -1, 0, 1, 4, Reverend, Reverend, 5, Speaker, Speaker
John III Sobieski,Hippolyta, 0, 6, 1, Poles and Lithuanians,Polish/Lithuanian,0, 1, -1,
Mohandas Gandhi,Indira Gandhi, 0, 7, 2, Indians, Indian, -1, -1, 0, 2, Maharaja, Maharaja,
Alexis I, Alexis I, 0, 1, 3, Muscovites, Muscovite, 1, 0, -1, 2, Tsar, Tsarina, 4, Patriarch, Matriarch
Shaka, Shakala, 0, 2, 0, Zulus, Zulu, 1, 0, 0,
Louis XIV, Joan of Arc, 0, 3, 3, French, French, 1, 1, 1, 4, Archbishop, Archbishop, 6, Premier, Premier
Montezuma, Nazca, 0, 4, 0, Aztecs, Aztec, 0, -1, 1,
Mao Tse Tung, Wu Zhao, 0, 5, 2, Chinese, Chinese, 0, 0, 1, 3, Chairman, Chairperson
Henry VIII, Elizabeth I, 0, 6, 3, English, English, 0, 1, 0, 4, Lord Protector, Lady Protector, 6, Prime Minister, Prime Minister
Mehmed IV, Mehmed IV, 0, 7, 2, Turks, Ottoman, 1, 1, -1, 1, Sultan, Sultana, 2, Sultan, Sultana, 4, Sultan, Sultana
Cunobelin, Boadicea, 0, 1, 0, Celts, Celtic, -1, 1, 0, 4, Druid, Druid
Tokugawa, Amaterasu, 0, 2, 2, Japanese, Japanese, 1, -1, -1, 2, Shogun, Shogun, 6, Prime Minister, Prime Minister
Canute, Gunnhild, 0, 3, 3, Vikings, Viking, 1, 1, 0, 1, Warlord, Warlord
Leopold I, Leopold I, 0, 4, 3, Imperials, Imperial, 1, 1, 1, 2, Emperor, Empress 4, Archbishop, Archbishop
Charles XI Pfalz,Charles XI Pfalz, 0, 5, 0, Swedes, Swedish, 0, 0, 0, 4, Reverend, Reverend
Hannibal, Dido, 0, 6, 1, Carthaginians,Carthaginian,0, 0, -1,
Sitting Bull, Sacajawea, 0, 7, 0, Sioux, Sioux, 0, 0, 0, 1, Chief, Chief, 2, Great Chief, Great Chief

Saladin, ..., 0, 5, Arabs, Arab, 1, 0, 1, 4, Ayatollah, Ayatollah, 2, Sultan, Sultana
Atawallpa, ..., 0, 1, Incas, Inca, -1, 1, 1,

And as a treat' attached below is a preview of two units:

The first is, obviously, a new rendering of Sobieski back in his old Hetman days. I decided to replace the old one as I decided not to use the English dragoon for the template for his Polish equivalent. The second is a Swedish soldier of the period - an accurate depiction of a musketeer of the Södermanlands regiment in all but hat (as you can see, I gave him a Swedish TYW hat, and the reference pic has the enlisted infantry in a more "Eastern/Northern" type of headgear. But the officer was wearing a Western-style hat, so it could be plausible.

Said pic will, at the very least, be a more accurate placeholder than the TYW unit...

[GhostOfDisco]

A bit of an update: for the time being, I'm moving the first turn from January to August of 1667, because I read somewhere that that was when Doroshenko moved against Poland.

Also, I'm having a bit of a problem with the events file, and according to the Report.txt:

@THEN GIVETECHNOLOGY found
looking for whom=
found technology=91 (integer 91)
Illegal GIVETECHNOLOGY statement

What am I doing wrong?

[curtsibling]

Can you post up the event in question?

[GhostOfDisco]

Better yet, I'll post the events file (which needs work, even without the error )

[curtsibling]

I think it might be because of a typo!
The event should read 'receiver', but you have 'reciever'.

I suspect this might be one of the culprits, especially if a typo
ends up cut and pasted in the events...Happens to me all the time!

[GhostOfDisco]

I've changed the events wording, and I've been looking at stuff on Frederick William and so forth to figure out how to organize the Brandenburg army.

Also ... do you know how to make something like a Tabor work in Civ II? It seems they were still in use in this era, and they might be best described as mobile forts/Barracks ... but I have no idea how to make this work for land units (I know land units can sort of work as aircraft carriers - Kobiyashi made it work in LOTOR and Boco did as well in El Aurens, but land units...)

[Elensar]

If they're "mobile forts", I'd suggest high defense (relatively speaking), but make them mobile (however much fits this kind of thing, which is not saying much) and house rule against parking them in cities.

If they're for one of the nonplayer civs, that won't work, unfortunately. But the AI isn't likely to use them well in any case.

[GhostOfDisco]

I had an idea for a Tabor unit - make it a domain 3 unit, but with a Trireme flag (and make a 1 in 1 chance that it will be lost at C). This will (more or less) confine it to land, and make it unable (or so I've heard) to place it in cities. Of course, I'm not sure if there are any

Perhaps the best option would be to make them the "fortify" graphic, or dispense with them altogether.

(Also, is it just me, or are there less advanced unit slots than unit slots in general? Can you add more lines to the advanced unit list? I hope it is possible...)

Did some testing of the siege of Kamieniec yesterday. Took a bit of doing and re-doing, but I think I might have the general hang of it. I do need to diversify the main forces, though - I'll definitely replace some of those Janissaries and Wallachian infantry with Siphais and Wallachian cavalry, respectively. (Does anyone have any information on 17th century/Battle of Vienna-era Wallachian soldiers? Preferably pics? The guy I'm using is a placeholder.)

Also, what kind of units should be guarding the various Turkish cities? I've got Moldavian, Wallachian and Transylvanian infantry guarding their respective haunts, but I'm not sure what to do about the Muslim/Turkish, Croatian, Hungarian et al. cities under Ottoman control.

I should also mention that in my current events, I've got the Tartars and Cossacks blocking the roads out of Kamieniec because, historically, they blocked the exits out of the city/fort in the real battle.

And here's a pic of my tryout of the seige...

[McMonkey]

Looking good. The Tabor as fortified graphic is not a bad idea. My poor brain is too frazzled at the moment to add anything sensible but I am still keeping tabs on this project and will post something constructive when I am feeling a bit more fresh.

Keep it up

[GhostOfDisco]

And here's some Tartar graphics I whipped up after seeing some reference pics from the time period I'm in (i.e. the mid-17th century; since some of these conflict had been going on since the 16th century, you never know when an undated reference pic is referring to...)

[curtsibling]

That battle image is exciting to see!

Cannot wait to try these epic struggles...!

[GhostOfDisco]

There is one problem - once the Turks reach the city, they want to negotiate!

I think the solution is to somehow make the Turks unable to negotiate until they take the city (mark off negotiation when they get the tech "March on Kamieniec", then let them speak when they take the city and thus lose the tech.)

Unfortuantely, I'm not sure how to make it work with the Negotiator tag - I tried a similar thing with the Tartars and Chigirin, but was never able to make it work...

[EZRhino]

That sounds like an excellent solution. If you're still having trouble making it work, PM me your events and rules.txts. I'll take a shot at fixing it for you

[GhostOfDisco]

Just a unit update - Wallachian infantry.

Now, I based these guys on a picture from this site, so I'm not sure if he's accurate as to this period or not - in fact, I wouldn't be surprised if he's a century too early - but at least he'll make a better placeholder graphic than the TYW guy.

[GhostOfDisco]

Tried playing the game with EZRhino's modified events, and it still doesn't seem to work - while the Tartars will go to war if you don't give them technology, they still want to talk at the beginning.

I tried some of my own stuff (such as setting the Negotiator tag for the Tartars as "Set" at the beginning), but it didn't seem to work. Or maybe I forgot to DELEVENT (though I'm sure I didn't) I dunno.

Please tell me what you think of the most current events file...

[EZRhino]

Actually it does work, I just tried it. The reason why is I accidentally left a space between the talkermask=0betc (i.e. talkermask= 0b)...

Delete the spaces, delevent the playtest save and it will work fine...

[GhostOfDisco]

Actually, I think it's Negotiation rather than Negotiatior that has the talkermask.

Did some tweaking last night (including the aforementioned change, I think ) and it works! Though I do want to eventually talk with the Turks, but there are just some periods when they shouldn't talk (like, say, when marching on Kamieniec and Vienna, for example) but they should be able to talk before that. I'm hoping the "Set" setting of "Negotiator" will make me be able to do this, but I'm not sure...

Anyway, here's a pic of a playtest of the Siege of Kamieniec...

[fairline]

Originally posted by GhostOfDisco
Can anyone help me with Swedish uniforms? I found this site, but it's Swedish and autotranslation sites are working worse than usual.

I have the power of website translation:

http://www.algonet.se/~hogman/uniforms_army.htm

(I pressed the 'information in English' button at the top of the site )

EDIT: You get the last laugh here as I've belated noticed only the first page is translated

I have a few plates of Swedish and other Scandinavian uniforms from the late 18th Century. What info is it you need in particular?

[GhostOfDisco]

Well, what I'd need is uniforms of 17th-century Swedish soldiers, from the Deluge onward but before Charles XII's uniform reforms of 1683 (I think- or was it 1687?).

I think what I'd really need at this stage is some pics of Swedish dragoons from this period, as I've got some references to the Swedish infantry and curiassers, so...

[curtsibling]

GhostOfDisco, If you can post a list of what cities you need (I know, my memory fails me!) I will get cracking on them this weekend...!