MLB Offseason Thread

[Imran Siddiqui]

The first of the major awards is in (and no, I don't count Gold Gloves among them):

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=2661785

NEW YORK -- Brandon Webb of the Arizona Diamondbacks won a wide-open race for the NL Cy Young Award, beating out San Diego closer Trevor Hoffman on Tuesday.

One of six pitchers who tied for the league lead with a pedestrian total of 16 wins, Webb received 15 of 32 first-place votes and 103 points in balloting by the Baseball Writers' Association of America. Hoffman, who broke the career saves record last season, got 12 first-place votes and 77 points.

St. Louis Cardinals ace Chris Carpenter, the 2005 Cy Young Award winner, finished third with two first-place votes and 63 points.

Houston's Roy Oswalt, who led the NL with a 2.98 ERA, got the other three first-place selections and came in fourth.

Webb, who went 16-8 with a 3.10 ERA, was listed second on seven ballots and third on seven others. No pitcher was included on every entry.

Well deserved win for Webb

[Arrian]

I would've voted for Oswalt, but it was so close it hardly matters (except perhaps to Oswalt, Webb and Carpenter ). Hoffman shouldn't have been 2nd, though, should he? Yikes.

...

In other news, it looks more and more like the Red Sox put in the top bid for that Japanese pitcher. In a way, I hope that's true.

I like the Sheffield and Wright trades, btw.

-Arrian

[Imran Siddiqui]

The rumor on the Red Sox bid for Daisuke is that a lot of it is to keep the Yanks from getting him. They only have to pay the fee to the club if they actually end up signing Daisuke. If they don't, then his Japanese club said they'll keep him for the last year of his contract.

And the O's are the ones who are really liking the Wright deal, especially since the Yanks are paying for half of Wright's salary .

[Arrian]

Of course. Any bid by either club would take denial to the other into account.

I would be fine with him staying in Japan. Works for me.

The Yanks dumped a guy I wanted dumped and got a decent young reliever in return. I think they're paying 4/7 of his salary, but I could be wrong. They were on the hook for that no matter what, though ($4million buyout, $7million to keep him).

I'm fine with that. The O's get to gamble that reuniting Mazzone the magician with Wright will turn him into a good pitcher again. I think that the fact that he's still in the AL means that won't happen.

-Arrian

[Imran Siddiqui]

But the fact that he's being paid $3mil by the O's ($4 mil being picked up by the Yanks) and being reunited with Mazzone, makes this quite a deal for the O's. Putting it in these terms, the O's are only paying for Wright a similar number as the Mets are paying for Steve Trachsel. Even if he's the average veteran pitcher he was last year, $3 mil is the going rate for that.

[Arrian]

Imran,

I disagree it's "quite a deal for the Os." Jaret Wright sucks, and frankly I'd be surprised if he managed to match last year's mediocrity. There is a chance Baltimore will get $3million in value out of him. There is a chance he'll get hurt again and hardly pitch. There is a chance he'll pitch and be absolutely awful.

In any event, the Yanks were on the hook for $4 million even had they simply cut him loose (stupid goddamned contract - one of the worst in the post-dynasty era), so paying him $4 million to pitch (likely badly) for Baltimore and getting a decent reliever (maybe) in return is fine by me.

...

Matsusaka bid = $51.1 million. Holy ****.

-Arrian

[OzzyKP]

Verlander
Leyland
Sheffield

[Deity Dude]

Originally posted by OzzyKP
Verlander
Leyland
Sheffield

Not so sure about Sheffield. We already have a bunch of Power Hitting Right Handed Outfielders. So now we get a 39 year old one coming off an injury. To do that we give up Humberto Sanchez and 2 other good prospects. Time will tell, but I am not so hot on that move.

[Imran Siddiqui]

Originally posted by Arrian
Imran,

I disagree it's "quite a deal for the Os." Jaret Wright sucks, and frankly I'd be surprised if he managed to match last year's mediocrity. There is a chance Baltimore will get $3million in value out of him. There is a chance he'll get hurt again and hardly pitch. There is a chance he'll pitch and be absolutely awful.

And there is a chance that Mazzone knows what is wrong with him and can have him pitching well, as Wright's best year (by far) was in Atlanta. $3 mil is nothing. Hell, John Thompson of the Braves makes around $5 mil. Esteban Loiaza made $6 mil. Paul Byrd makes $7 mil. If you are even close to average veteran pitcher, $3 mil is a value you'll get.

[OzzyKP]

Originally posted by Deity Dude


Not so sure about Sheffield. We already have a bunch of Power Hitting Right Handed Outfielders. So now we get a 39 year old one coming off an injury. To do that we give up Humberto Sanchez and 2 other good prospects. Time will tell, but I am not so hot on that move.

Well Sheffield is going to be our DH. And we absolutely need some more power. It is a "win now" move, and if it pays off then great. We have lots of pitching talent, and it is never easy to give up prospects, but we can't use all of them, and we do need some more hitters.

[Deity Dude]

Lets Thames DH all season and he will probably hit more homers than Sheffield. The one big thiing that he brings that the Tigers really need is someone who can work the count.

[MichaeltheGreat]

Originally posted by Arrian

...

Matsusaka bid = $51.1 million. Holy ****.

-Arrian

Epstein's on crack. In fact, Epstein sucks. By the time Boras is done with his end, the Sox will be spending insane money on a total gamble. I like Matsuzaka as a pitcher, but whether his game will translate to the AL for a whole season, let alone three or more, is up for grabs, as is whether or not he'll get hit by a meteor, blow out his arm, or any of a number of other things that could go wrong. If anything does go wrong, the Sox will have so much money down the hole they won't be able to fix it.

What's worse is the way Esptein's rumored to be going after Drew, who is basically Trot for twice the price and way less than half the work ethic. Epstein's so busy trying to make up for bad deals with worse deals that I swear Steiny must have a little Theo voodoo doll he sticks his dick into.

[Arrian]

In fact, Epstein sucks.

Wow, the shine came off the golden boy pretty quick.

-Arrian

[Imran Siddiqui]

Epstein is not on crack. Daisuke has far more value than simply being a top notch starting pitcher. It is the Red Sox's entry into the Japanese market, which is a highly lucrative market to be in and so far is really only penetrated by the Mariners, Dodgers, and Yankees. The $51 million will pale to the money the Sox make on merchandise sales and television rights over the long run in Japan. It is basically an investment in the Japanese market.

[Arrian]

I'll concur with that. The bid was pretty astronomical even considering that, though. It might be worth it. He's gotta pitch well for it to really be worth it, and while there is a good chance he will, it's certainly a gamble.

The Sox are betting on D-Mats ( ) being their Ichiro; their Matsui (Hideki, not Kaz ). Both of those guys are worth more to their teams than their playing ability alone would suggest.

-Arrian

[asleepathewheel]

Matsuzaka

I'll remember that name next time I hear a RS fan complaing about the yankees free spending.

[Imran Siddiqui]

Originally posted by Arrian
I'll concur with that. The bid was pretty astronomical even considering that, though. It might be worth it. He's gotta pitch well for it to really be worth it, and while there is a good chance he will, it's certainly a gamble.

The Sox are betting on D-Mats ( ) being their Ichiro; their Matsui (Hideki, not Kaz ). Both of those guys are worth more to their teams than their playing ability alone would suggest.

-Arrian

Yep, and worth more than $51 mil. The Yanks have their pipeline to Asia, the Red Sox couldn't be left behind. There is a very large cash cow in Japan. Cities that hated the players when they were in Japan (rival team cities) will tune in to see those players play in the US.

[MichaeltheGreat]

Originally posted by Arrian


Wow, the shine came off the golden boy pretty quick.

-Arrian

I've never been a big fan. A lot of others haven't been, either, if you read the NE press, SoSH, BDD, etc.

Dump Cabrera, sign Renteria, dump Renteria and 10 million subsidy for Marte, sign Gonzales, trade Marte for Coco Crispies, trade Meredith, Bowen and Bard for Loretta (by the time you factor out Mirabelli from both sides of the equation), then let Gonzales and Loretta go so you can pursue Julio Lugo? Show no interest in retaining Trot, but pursue Drew for something close to Damon/MFY money?

[MichaeltheGreat]

Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui
Epstein is not on crack.

Look at the entire transaction history, not just everyone's pet bid for a deal at the moment.

Daisuke has far more value than simply being a top notch starting pitcher.

If, if, if, all depending on if they make a deal, and if they don't get held over too big a barrel by Boras, and if Matsuzaka doesn't turn into an Irabu.

It is the Red Sox's entry into the Japanese market, which is a highly lucrative market to be in and so far is really only penetrated by the Mariners, Dodgers, and Yankees. The $51 million will pale to the money the Sox make on merchandise sales and television rights over the long run in Japan. It is basically an investment in the Japanese market.

I lived in Japan and followed the Japan leagues. Still do. Most of the Japanese market will stay focused on their teams until there is major, systematic penetration of the majors by Japanese players. The real play in Japan isn't in merchandising rights (the Yankees and Dodgers dominated that before Matsui and Nomo, due to Japanese consumer's perceptions of LA and New York), it's in getting a footprint for scouting and recruiting and dealing with other Japan league teams.

The payoff could be there, if, if, if. The problem is if it will be enough in a three year window, if that's what Boras wants, and if the Sox have enough resources to fill all the remaining holes. Assuming Matsuzaka performs. If he's a 10-10 wonder with an ERA north of 4, then you'll be amazed at how little play he gets in Japan after the first year. The novelty has worn off, it's not like he's a rookie Nomo or Park.

[OzzyKP]

btw, a big congrats to Leyland and Verlander for manager and rookie of the year awards.

Oh, and it looks like we've resigned Sean Casey for another year.

[Kontiki]

Toronto has signed Frank Thomas. That is my one and likely only contribution to this thread.

[Imran Siddiqui]

Originally posted by MichaeltheGreat
I've never been a big fan. A lot of others haven't been, either, if you read the NE press, SoSH, BDD, etc.

Dump Cabrera, sign Renteria, dump Renteria and 10 million subsidy for Marte, sign Gonzales, trade Marte for Coco Crispies, trade Meredith, Bowen and Bard for Loretta (by the time you factor out Mirabelli from both sides of the equation), then let Gonzales and Loretta go so you can pursue Julio Lugo? Show no interest in retaining Trot, but pursue Drew for something close to Damon/MFY money?

All trumped by:

2004 World Series Champions. I dunno, I guess you can give that back for reversal of all those deals if you want .

If, if, if, all depending on if they make a deal, and if they don't get held over too big a barrel by Boras, and if Matsuzaka doesn't turn into an Irabu.

And if they don't make a deal, they prevent the Yankees from getting him, so still a plus.

And Matsuzaka is not an Irabu. He showed that in the World Baseball Classic against US batters. That and he has the right age, the right velocity, and the right number of pitches. He'll be better than Irabu, especially with the Red Sox's run support (his win numbers will be high at any rate).

This article points out some differences (number of pitches, Matsuzaka being in shape):

http://www.sportingnews.com/yourturn...c.php?t=149233

[snoopy369]

Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui
Epstein is not on crack. Daisuke has far more value than simply being a top notch starting pitcher. It is the Red Sox's entry into the Japanese market, which is a highly lucrative market to be in and so far is really only penetrated by the Mariners, Dodgers, and Yankees. The $51 million will pale to the money the Sox make on merchandise sales and television rights over the long run in Japan. It is basically an investment in the Japanese market.

Add the White Sox to that list ... they've had several Japanese players (from Japan directly) now, including their amazing second baseman

[asleepathewheel]

few can compete with the resume that one So Taguchi brings to the table.

[Deity Dude]

I am embarrassed to admit this but when Matsui first arrived I thougt his name was Matt Suey.

[MichaeltheGreat]

Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui
All trumped by:

2004 World Series Champions. I dunno, I guess you can give that back for reversal of all those deals if you want .

Epstein got lucky, in the sense that he hadn't broken the team yet, and that was the one off-season to trading deadline where his bad deals or non-deals didn't eclipse the good ones.

[asleepathewheel]

Cubbies have landed Soriano 8/136

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=2668465

CHICAGO -- The Chicago Cubs' ownership is showing new manager Lou Piniella that they are serious about winning.

Chicago radio station ESPN 1000 reported Sunday that the Cubs have agreed to an eight-year contract worth approximately $136 million with outfielder Alfonso Soriano.

The move would clearly mark the highlight in an already busy offseason for the Cubs, who have signed free-agent infielder Mark DeRosa and have re-signed third baseman Aramis Ramirez and righthander Kerry Wood.

But the biggest prize is Soriano, who is coming off an outstanding all-around season for the Washington Nationals in which he hit .277 with 46 home runs and 95 RBI. The 30-year-old ranked third in the National League in homers and also stole 41 bases -- the sixth-highest total in the circuit.

After complaining in spring training about having to move from second base to left field, Soriano blossomed in his new surroundings. He led the league with 22 outfield assists, six more than his closest competitor, and displayed respectable range for a converted infielder.

Soriano became the first player in baseball history with 40 home runs, 40 stolen bases and 20 outfield assists in a single season. He also became the first member of the 40-40-40 club, which encapsulates homers, stolen bases and doubles.

An All-Star in each of the last five years, Soriano owns a .280 average with 208 home runs and 560 RBI in eight seasons with the New York Yankees, Texas Rangers and the Nationals.

Soriano won the AL Rookie of the Year award with the Yankees in 2001, when he hit .268 with 18 homers and 73 RBI. He finished third in MVP voting the following season, when he increased his average to .300 and collected 39 homers and 102 RBI.

Looks like the cubbies are following the Reds in the all O-fence, no pitching (save CZ) mold.

As a cards fan, I love this move. Between AS and A-Ram, probably not going to have much left over for a pitching overhaul.

[Imran Siddiqui]

Wow... that's a lot of money.

He's a great player no doubt, but unless the Cubs are going to bottomless pool of money mode, they have greater needs.

[asleepathewheel]

Is he going to be worth 17 mil when he's 37 years old? Yikes.

[Stuie]

Phew! Glad the Phillies dodged that big-money bullet. He strikes out too much to "protect" Howard in the lineup. Of course, there aren't many other options....

And so far our big signing of the off-season has been: Wes Helms. That'll strike fear into the Mets.