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What government model do we want in Civ 3?

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  • What government model do we want in Civ 3?

    Please answer the poll!
    81
    Classical government model like Civ 1, 2 and 3
    6.17%
    5
    Classical government model but with a ton of government types
    11.11%
    9
    Social engineering model like SMAC
    48.15%
    39
    Policy sliders like Europa Universalis
    18.52%
    15
    Something new, fresh and simple
    3.70%
    3
    Something new, fresh and complex
    7.41%
    6
    No government types
    0.00%
    0
    Banana republic!
    4.94%
    4
    Last edited by Optimizer; January 19, 2005, 21:16.
    The difference between industrial society and information society:
    In an industrial society you take a shower when you have come home from work.
    In an information society you take a shower before leaving for work.

  • #2
    not sure what Europa Universalis' govt. types are. I imagine government in civ 4 to be based on SMAC's social engineering where you set the philosophical direction(s) of the govt. but with some additions.

    i vaguely remember in civ 1 while in a Democracy, the senate would occasionally overrule a declaration of war, and to impose your will you would change the govt. type. It would be quite realistic to have a model where various decisions of the head of state (the player) would be challenged by the governing body (parliament, senate etc) and it would be at times easier or harder to get a decision through the bureacracy. This 'ease' would depend on the politics of the majority party in power; i'll leave the mechanics for electing that party to others (i'm too lazy right now ).
    for example, say you wanted to allow equal access to education for the aristocracy and working class alike, but the majority party are opposed to anyone having education but titled, aristocratic, and generally blue-blooded people, then your policy wouldn't pass, and you'd continue with that system.

    Maybe this idea is too complicated to work effectively, but I'm sure those of us who want a realistic political and social model of government will come up with something that will work
    regards,

    Peter

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    • #3
      EU
      "The DPRK is still in a state of war with the U.S. It's called a black out." - Che explaining why orbital nightime pictures of NK show few lights. Seriously.

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      • #4
        I want a more historical and more realistic version of SMAC it's social engineering. Civ4 is a history game and not a science FICTION game after all.

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        • #5
          Some fictional/theoretical elements would be fine.
          "I predict your ignore will rival Ben's" - Ecofarm
          ^ The Poly equivalent of:
          "I hope you can see this 'cause I'm [flipping you off] as hard as I can" - Ignignokt the Mooninite

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          • #6
            Well, I'm not to well versed on some of the options in this poll. Here's an admission I've not posted before. I never played SMAC before.

            Okay, that being said, I selected "Classical government model but with a ton of government types" just because that's what I'm familiar with and like enough. More choices is better.

            However, I would be totally open to other ideas -- especially since so many people seem to like SMAC and EU. I never played EU either
            Haven't been here for ages....

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            • #7
              I'm with kolpo, something SMAC-ish but with more of an historical feel. I'd be even more radical, but I don't think we'll get it!
              Project Lead for The Clash of Civilizations
              A Unique civ-like game that will feature low micromanagement, great AI, and a Detailed Government model including internal power struggles. Demo 8 available Now! (go to D8 thread at top of forum).
              Check it out at the Clash Web Site and Forum right here at Apolyton!

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              • #8
                I picked Policy sliders like Europa Universalis. It could have been the SMAC model as well. Here are my $0.02.

                "Government" should not be Despotism, Monarchy, Republic, Democracy. I know there are more, but this is the way to win the game. Sometimes I skip Monarchy altogether. This is repetitive and doesn't encourage replay. There is no way to create the society you want.

                I don't know if any of you saw or played a game called The 3rd Millennium. A pretty poor game in general, but the government model was outstanding.

                I think Government should be a combination of the old Govs and a control panel. You have buttons and sliders where you decide on religious tolerance, slavery, propaganda etc. Discovering certain techs would add options to this panel. Picking certain Government models would allow you to decide what kind of a head of state you have. An elected one or a monarch. This would also affect the available buttons and sliders, but not to a major degree.

                This odel would be interesting in the sense that new ideas are usually met with sceptisism. What we find normal was shocking a generation ago. Moving the sliders too far could create unrest. Too little when the times are changing (in other civs, in technology etc), and we, the leader are out of touch. Playing with the sliders in a subtile way could sway opinion.

                Hard times during dramatic events like war, natural disasters etc would require different policies than peaceful times.

                Am I making sense?
                To be one with the Universe is to be very lonely - John Doe - Datalinks

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                • #9
                  Earthling7, I like your description of policy sliders. The interface sounds simple enough to use and it sounds like they provide numerous options for creating your very own Utopia
                  regards,

                  Peter

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                  • #10
                    I like Kolpo's idea.

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                    • #11
                      What is the difference between government model and type? Thx.

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                      • #12
                        Civ is just not as numbers based as EU so I don't think Sliders would work as well.

                        Personally, I thought SMAC's system was incredibly fun and provided a good variety in play because there wasn't really a best choice for all the options. It was however you felt like playing.
                        "Yay Apoc!!!!!!!" - bipolarbear
                        "At least there were some thoughts went into Apocalypse." - Urban Ranger
                        "Apocalype was a great game." - DrSpike
                        "In Apoc, I had one soldier who lasted through the entire game... was pretty cool. I like apoc for that reason, the soldiers are a bit more 'personal'." - General Ludd

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                        • #13
                          I want the different government types to represent different playing strategies. When warmongers and peaceful builders have the same government type as their optimals something is wrong.

                          Each of the more advanced government types should be extremely attractive for a particular strategy route, and the 'one size fits all' governments should be diminished in value.
                          One day Canada will rule the world, and then we'll all be sorry.

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                          • #14
                            I know many disliked CtP, but at least the government choices enticed you to switch government every so often to suit your current needs.
                            One day Canada will rule the world, and then we'll all be sorry.

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                            • #15
                              I vote for SMAC's system, which I think is by far the Best system for a TBS game (EU is not a TBS, and while a great game has many fundamental differences we can't overlook)

                              The problem in civ is that "Government" encompases a lot more than just regime type, but also economics and social values, which should not be conflated.

                              As for making it realistic, is not very hard- the same 4 lines of questions would be enough-but having this would help differentiate between a right wing dictatorship,a communist dictatorsghip, and so forth. And n the end, you could try to have a type of government that hardly ever really existed, but see if you can make it work.
                              If you don't like reality, change it! me
                              "Oh no! I am bested!" Drake
                              "it is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong" Voltaire
                              "Patriotism is a pernecious, psychopathic form of idiocy" George Bernard Shaw

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