wah!
Kids today. They don't want to put in their dues.
http://www.nytimes.com/2004/07/16/ed...n/16union.html
The fast-growing movement to unionize graduate students at the nation's private universities suffered a crushing setback yesterday when the National Labor Relations Board reversed itself and ruled that students who worked as research and teaching assistants did not have the right to unionize.
In a case involving Brown University, the labor board ruled 3 to 2 that graduate teaching and research assistants were essentially students, not workers, and thus should not have the right to unionize to negotiate over wages, benefits and other conditions of employment.
The Republican-controlled board reversed a four-year-old decision involving New York University, a private institution, in which the board, then controlled by Democrats, concluded that graduate teaching and research assistants should be able to unionize because their increased responsibilities had essentially turned them into workers.
I hate this government so very much.
"Beware of the man who works hard to learn something, learns it, and finds himself no wiser than before. He is full of murderous resentment of people who are ignorant without having come by their ignorance the hard way. "
-Bokonon
wah!
Kids today. They don't want to put in their dues.
What the hell are you talking about?
"Beware of the man who works hard to learn something, learns it, and finds himself no wiser than before. He is full of murderous resentment of people who are ignorant without having come by their ignorance the hard way. "
-Bokonon
WTF is wrong? Next you know, high schoolers would be unionizing and making demands over homework
You're obviously not in the least aware of what grad students do.
"Beware of the man who works hard to learn something, learns it, and finds himself no wiser than before. He is full of murderous resentment of people who are ignorant without having come by their ignorance the hard way. "
-Bokonon
Lab work, to get their PhD.
1. The work isn't necessarily "lab work."
2. The work doesn't necessarily go to writing a Masters/Doctoral thesis.
Anyways, that was a statement of fact, not a question.
"Beware of the man who works hard to learn something, learns it, and finds himself no wiser than before. He is full of murderous resentment of people who are ignorant without having come by their ignorance the hard way. "
-Bokonon
What the hell do grad students need a union for anyway?
To bargain over wages, working conditions, health care, administrative practices, etc., etc. The same reasons any other group of workers would need a union for.
"Beware of the man who works hard to learn something, learns it, and finds himself no wiser than before. He is full of murderous resentment of people who are ignorant without having come by their ignorance the hard way. "
-Bokonon
cept you aren't workers
I won't be one for another year. And the only measure through which they're not workers is the NLRB's dumbass ruling.
"Beware of the man who works hard to learn something, learns it, and finds himself no wiser than before. He is full of murderous resentment of people who are ignorant without having come by their ignorance the hard way. "
-Bokonon
What exactly do you call teaching a class or assisting a professor's research, if not working?
"Beware of the man who works hard to learn something, learns it, and finds himself no wiser than before. He is full of murderous resentment of people who are ignorant without having come by their ignorance the hard way. "
-Bokonon
Studying?
That's idiotic. If teaching and assisting in research are "studying" instead of "working," then there's no such thing as "working."
Last edited by Ramo; July 17, 2004 at 20:36.
"Beware of the man who works hard to learn something, learns it, and finds himself no wiser than before. He is full of murderous resentment of people who are ignorant without having come by their ignorance the hard way. "
-Bokonon
An opportunity ?Originally posted by Ramo
What exactly do you call teaching a class or assisting a professor's research, if not working?
You could always flip burgers if you want...
And I see that you can always be an ******* if you want... On second thought, you might not have on option in the matter.
So your conclusion is what? Because you consider being a grad student a better opportunity than flipping burgers, grad students ought not have the right to unionize?
"Beware of the man who works hard to learn something, learns it, and finds himself no wiser than before. He is full of murderous resentment of people who are ignorant without having come by their ignorance the hard way. "
-Bokonon
Assistantships are a REWARD, they are a rare opportunity that students compete for, the equivalent of an internship.
You should be happy that you get paid at all for the experience.
Spoiled brat.
Yes, clearly only the independently wealth deserve to get a graduate degree.
Self-righteous *****.
"Beware of the man who works hard to learn something, learns it, and finds himself no wiser than before. He is full of murderous resentment of people who are ignorant without having come by their ignorance the hard way. "
-Bokonon
"work study" is just a way for companies to get cheap labor.
Nothing to see here, move along: http://selzlab.blogspot.com
The attempt to produce Heaven on Earth often produces Hell. -Karl Popper
True, I'm sure things such as scholarships, grants, loans, and part time jobs, don't exist.Originally posted by Ramo
Yes, clearly only the independently wealth deserve to get a graduate degree.
Self-righteous *****.
Scholarships, etc. are for undergrads.
And teaching/research assistantships are the part-time jobs for grad students. That's the point. How are grad students supposed to make a living if they shouldn't even get paid for that?
"Beware of the man who works hard to learn something, learns it, and finds himself no wiser than before. He is full of murderous resentment of people who are ignorant without having come by their ignorance the hard way. "
-Bokonon
????
You can still get all of those things as a grad student.
I've heard of grad scholarships. And Ramo...if you don't have time for a part time job, what are you doing here?
"Yay Apoc!!!!!!!" - bipolarbear
"At least there were some thoughts went into Apocalypse." - Urban Ranger
"Apocalype was a great game." - DrSpike
"In Apoc, I had one soldier who lasted through the entire game... was pretty cool. I like apoc for that reason, the soldiers are a bit more 'personal'." - General Ludd
And Ramo...if you don't have time for a part time job, what are you doing here?
Where did I say that I don't have a part-time job? I work 20 hours a week, thanks.
Again, I just am saying that I want the right to organize with my fellow employees, and collectively bargain with my school.
????
You can still get all of those things as a grad student.
In physics, my understanding is that's not a main source of funding (or at least, it's not enough to live on).
"Beware of the man who works hard to learn something, learns it, and finds himself no wiser than before. He is full of murderous resentment of people who are ignorant without having come by their ignorance the hard way. "
-Bokonon
The research I did for my assistantship and the research I did for my master's thesis were independent of each other. My advisor was contracted to do some research for an aerospace company, and I was then essentially sub-contracted to do the actual research. But, since I was ostensibly working only 30 hours a week (except for the weeks that I worked 30+ hours, of course) and was a full-time student at the same time, I guess I wasn't doing "real" work. I must have been "studying" for, umm, the classes that I was taking that had nothing whatsoever to do with the research I was doing for my assistantship. **** on a shingle, man, where do you get your information from?Originally posted by Kuciwalker
Lab work, to get their PhD.
Does this argument apply to every non-burger-flipping job, or only to graduate research/teaching positions? In other words, should every union (except perhaps the "brotherhood of burger-flippers", though it could be argued that they should be grateful for the opportunity to be employed in the lucrative career of burger-flipping) be illegalized on the grounds that the job being unionized is better than a job flipping burgers?Originally posted by Ted Striker
An opportunity?
No, but the primary purpose of graduate research is working towards one's graduate degree (even if the research isn't directly related to your thesis, that is why you're doing it).
The primary reason I did graduate research was so that I could afford to eat while I was in school.Originally posted by Kuciwalker
No, but the primary purpose of graduate research is working towards one's graduate degree
Besides, if what you say were true, then there wouldn't be such a thing as post-doctoral research assistants.
No.Originally posted by Kuciwalker
No, but the primary purpose of graduate research is working towards one's graduate degree
The primary purpose of graduate research is to do the professor's dirty work for him. IOW, get whipped into shape to be a lab technician when you graduate.
(\__/) 07/07/1937 - Never forget
(='.'=) "Claims demand evidence; extraordinary claims demand extraordinary evidence." -- Carl Sagan
(")_(") "Starting the fire from within."
Besides, if what you say were true, then there wouldn't be such a thing as post-doctoral research assistants.
But you see, having a post-doc is a priviledge, interning for a permanent position. Their bosses are really just doing them a favor, so they should be required to give fellatios.
"Beware of the man who works hard to learn something, learns it, and finds himself no wiser than before. He is full of murderous resentment of people who are ignorant without having come by their ignorance the hard way. "
-Bokonon
Oh great, I'm agreeing with a communist and an anarchist.
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