Early Landing - discovering flight

[rjmatsleepers]

I have played a few EL games recently and there has been a consistent pattern that I "have" to start researching flight after discovering computers. As a result I only get one turn in which my SSC has a research lab before the effect of the Collossus is cancelled. Should I be able to discover computers earlier to give me a longer run with the maximum beaker output? Is there a trade-off with automobile (and hence superhighways)?

Yes I realise I could probably work it out by looking at the tech tree, but I'm lazy and someone might know the answer already.

RJM at Sleeper's

[debeest]

There's sort of a bottleneck in the tech tree where you have to learn either automobile or flight. If you choose automobile, you can go around flight to learn mass production and computers. You can hold off on mobile warfare until after computers, and then you can get robotics, but then you're stuck with virtual dead ends: labor union, recycling, or nuclear fission. If you choose fission, you can then learn nuclear power and laser.

So, under the right conditions, after computers and before flight you should be able to learn mobile warfare and robotics and the fission-nukes-laser series and labor union and recycling. However, this is subject to the rules on which techs are available on a given turn. If you learn those rules and plan carefully, I'm sure you can get a few techs during the period when you have Colossus, SETI, and superhighways all working for you. Shouldn't take long!

[Bloody Monk]

While the advice Sir debeest gives is true, this is a question about EARLY Landing Game tech choices; and therefore, notice should be taken of the fact that most all those techs mentioned are unnecessary for an early launch. You will want the nuc fis-laser series but not the others.

The result is sometimes avoided by a careful switch between the Atom Series and Computer series, always avoiding Flight. It is at this point that knowledge of what techs will be offered next is essential; and, it is here that AI trades for the ones skipped earlier can keep things moving without a hitch. But, don't take an off path choice just to avoid Flight. Think of it differently and perhaps you will feel better about it.

It's seldom that I have had more than one or two techs between Computers and Flight. Rather than being upset that there were not more, I focus on the blessing that SETI, or a few research labs, have come just in time to erase the inevitable effect of losing Colossus.

The only way I can envision getting more turns with both is if an AI had gotten Tactics and you could trade for it while skipping WC to Leadership. That might let you get to Computers faster while still having the Atom Series available before having to bite the Flight bullet. But, I have never seem that yet.

We can hope, though!!

Monk

[Elephant]

I like to reserve the NF/NP/Las group to plug in after Computers. I use SlowThinker's CIV2PLAN to track my tech progress and "what-if" a few ahead. Once Communism has been discovered it and Esp are worthwhile off-path techs for filling in when you are trying to postpone Flight. I try to get all the other necessary techs so that my last group is Fli/Rad/AFl/Roc/SFl, with one off-path (Esp or Mob). I've been doing OCC's lately without Robotics for ManufPlant, but previously that was part of my pre-Flight plan as well. After Ind and Corp, bee-line to Auto, then Comp, then get the rest of the pre-reqs before Flight.

In tech gifting the AI, avoid giving away Combust or Refine so they don't get a premature start on Flight. Refine is actually a pre-req for Plastics, and NucPower and Laser are needed for Super and Fusion, so once you get in this range you should stop gifting. SuperHighways and ResearchLab should give you enough of a lift to make up for the loss of Colossus and increasing gap over KeyCiv.

[rjmatsleepers]

Originally posted by Elephant
I like to reserve the NF/NP/Las group to plug in after Computers. I use SlowThinker's CIV2PLAN to track my tech progress and "what-if" a few ahead.

Ah, that's where I've been going wrong. I've been researching nuclear fission, nuclear power and the laser before computers.

As BM says, I don't deliberately take off-path techs simply to avoid flight, but since I seem to have to take a lot of off-path techs in this part of the game, I suspect I need to be better at when and what I trade with the AI. At the moment I am using a JIT tech-trade philosophy in order to keep down research costs. However I'm begining to wonder whether this actually increases the number of off-path techs I need to learn.

Mostly, I don't learn the techs that Debeest mentions except when forced off-path. Mobile warfare and robotics are certainly useful if (when) the AI gets frisky, but my current approach is to build 63 vans before building the apollo programme which (I think) minimises the period from apollo to landing.

Thaks for all the suggestions guys.

RJM at Sleeper's