The Moon

[Pizza]

How about extending the game a little bit and adding a moon(s). There could be few resources on the moon like iron and gems.

There could be a great wonder "Lunar Observatory" buildable only on the moon.


Of course, the game would need to be able to handle multiple maps...

[Apocalypse]

Nah, the game would probably have to go a little too far into the future for that to be in the regular game.

[Pizza]

It's already happening IRL.

[Apocalypse]

It's being talked about IRL. Big difference compared to stuff actually happening.

[Cmonkey]

And launching a space ship to AC is much more plausible....brilliant.

Moron.

[Apocalypse]

Well, the spaceship is more of a placehold for a method of industrial victory and anything else. You can't compare the two.

[Cmonkey]

Couldn't moon colonies/research labs then be that same placeholder? I mean if it's just a placeholder, the actual "thing" that it is, then is meaningless, correct?

[Apocalypse]

Yeah, but I'd think a lot of veterans would agree that they like Alpha Centauri better. And it probably means less needless micromangagement than with moon colonies.

[Nikolai]

A space layer? I think not.

[Dauphin]

You don't actually have an Alpha Centauri map, and so if you wanted you could consider it a trip to Mars without any difficulty. Manned Mars missions seem the most plausible mixed with novel - that is, we've got the Apollo missions to the Moon as wonders already.

Adding the extra map layer, whatever it may be representing, is the major point of contention as it is that which will effect gameplay.

[Epistax]

I have no problem with Civ going further into the future-- just you'll have to disable UN victory, alpha centauri race victory, or other victories that are likely to occur much sooner. That is, the normal game should not be affected at all, just append another age to the game as for as tech/improvements/units are concerned. And for Pete's sake, push the Cure for Cancer into the next age. Geeze.

[jomateix]

Sputnik and achiving the Moon could be easily resumed in:

1 small wonder (Sputnik) : Allows pay an amount each year for satellite maintaining. These payments reduced by time when technology advances. Satellites allows to see the terrain (cities and units when technology advances) and reduce the cost of spy actions, this cost enlarges when other's technology is similar.

1 big wonder (Moon) : Gives XXX extra stuff, i.e.: a 10% science ratio and all the cultural-like cuontries now love you (not always, just put the hate counter to 0).

[alva]

Yeah, that's what this game needs..more MM when you already have 50+ cities, sounds like fun.

[realpolitic]

NASA thinks ice may be in the crater in the South Pole, this would provide chemical propellant. It's also possible it has Helium-3, useful for fusion. Either one could make for interesting play.

[Spiffor]

I support the idea of Civ4 supporting several maps, for scenario purposes. It could be used in a variety of settings involving a difficulty to travel from one map to another (age of discovery, interplanetary wars, fantasy scenarios opposing several planes of existence etc.)

I think it would be better to turn the Alpha Centauri mission into a manned mission to Mars (more cohesive with the realistic/historical theme of Civ), but I don't see it coming. The journey to AC is the kind of Civ-tradition that is likely to exist as long as the franchise is alive

Wrt a "Moon observatory": why not? It could be a late-game wonder, just like Cure for Cancer or SDI systems. It would be more thrilling than SETI I think

[notyoueither]

Originally posted by Epistax
I have no problem with Civ going further into the future-- just you'll have to disable UN victory, alpha centauri race victory, or other victories that are likely to occur much sooner. That is, the normal game should not be affected at all, just append another age to the game as for as tech/improvements/units are concerned. And for Pete's sake, push the Cure for Cancer into the next age. Geeze.

Or don't stop the game at the UN or SS necessarily, but allow the option to count those things as points in the overall picture of which was the greatest civilization.

[Adagio]

Originally posted by notyoueither
Or don't stop the game at the UN or SS necessarily, but allow the option to count those things as points in the overall picture of which was the greatest civilization.

That is what I have been looking for in every Civ game...


Adding an extra layer to the game, only makes it worse. The most annoying thing in ctp was the space-layer where you could build cities in orbit (IIRC), which was shown on another layer. Kinda like the same way you want with Moon-cities. Defently not something that would make the game any better

[Trifna]

As an objective, the moon is bleak compared to Mars...
I always thought, since the beginning, that sending something for Alpha Centauri is a bit... less Civish than Trekish.
In Civ, it seemed a bit far away, far fetched.

[Tattila the Hun]

How about a space elevator? I mean, we can send stuff to space, but it's horrendously expensive...

[realpolitic]

How about terraforming a planet or large moon? That would require development of a nonchemical rocket (solar sails, ion propulsion, electromagnetic tethers etc.) Those techs have already been tested, but are not in widespread use; or the mining of ice on the moon's South Pole.Space elevators are also good, but easily sabotaged.

[Shogun Gunner]

Tough question to answer when every reply post can be boiled down to

1. Why not?
OR
2. Why?

I could live with it either way - moon or no moon.

[Xorbon]

Originally posted by Pizza
It's already happening IRL.

Can I have some of what you have?

[Spiffor]

Originally posted by Adagio
Adding an extra layer to the game, only makes it worse. The most annoying thing in ctp was the space-layer where you could build cities in orbit (IIRC), which was shown on another layer. Kinda like the same way you want with Moon-cities. Defently not something that would make the game any better

I partly disagree.

A Space-layer (or Moon layer, or Mars layer, or subterranean layer or what have you) would indeed be boring in the regular game. However, there are plenty of possible scenarios where it would be a real boon.

Just imagine for example an "age of discovery" scenario that has several "layers", i.e the map of several continents, separated by the difficulty to navigate from one to another. Or imagine a "Mars vs. Earth" scenario. The game's ability to support multiple layers (not in the core game) would be a boon.

[General Ludd]

A sci-fi strategy game that incorporated the entiere solar system, in a fashion similiar to Empire of the Fading suns (only keeping it in check and not going outside of the solar system) would be pretty cool. But not really civ.

[jomateix]

Civ 4, as teh other civs, is about the social evolution of mankind from a tribal society to a globalized one. Is more probable to include diplomatic agreements to create UE-like states composed of players (i move workers, you warriors, you build things in cities, etc...) than colonizing the moon.

As I said before, just some wonders and a new satellite idea and that's all IMHO.

[orrery]

You could have a Mars Terraformation project or build O'Neill space colonies.

Terraforming Mars as the 'space race' victory would seem superior to the Alpha Centauri method.

[Xorbon]

I don't know if terraforming Mars would be "superior" to reaching Alpha Centauri, but it would be more realistic. Even more realistic would be to just colonize Mars for a victory. All that being said, it's kind of a tradition for Civ to have the Alpha Centauri victory condition. So, I'd rather keep the AC victory condition just for that reason.

[GePap]

Terraforming a planet and sending an iterstellar voyage are both equally "realisitc". In essence, both attempt to show that success of your civ throught immense future glories, and one of the point bieng made here is perhaps allow the player to carry out those glories directly, not in some immensely abtract way (imagine a game set in Europe in 1000 throught 1500 or something like that having a project called "New World Empire", in which all you can do id send the expedition, and there, your done).

Perhaps a point would be to change how one wins the game peacefully- the diplomatic victory is fine, but it should be more nuanced, more of a horserace of real politics, as oposed to the simplistic vote of today.

[Robert Plomp]

Alpha Centauri is the classic goal for civ-games.
It shouldn't be changed.

Civ: Alpha Centauri
Civ II: Alpha Centauri
Civ III: Alpha Centauri
Civ IV: .......... why change it?

[Nikolai]

Keep AC.