The Distant Rumblings of War!

curtsibling · January 13, 2008, 15:47

What is that wheezing noise on the Soviet border, you might ask?
A malfunctioning Panzer gearbox, or a wounded artillery horse?

Actually, it is Curt Sibling struggling with a chesty cough and flu....!
As he puts more and more work onto his latest incarnation of Dictator!

This time, I am looking to recreate WW2 conflicts from June 1941, till Dec 1946 on a massive
European map - Allowing players to battle as varied CIVs, and with new multi-file mayhem...

With multi-file systems it is easy to recreate things like bad weather or a unit list that will
evolve with time. The possibilities to change history will depend on chances being taken
and choices being made! There will still be invasions and events to keep players alert!

Play for mastery as the military super powers of the Allies, Axis or Soviets.
Only one empire can win through and truly be called ruler of Europe!

Or go for a different challenge as you try to survive as Italy, Finland, Romania, and Vichy France.
As a mini-nation, you will be free to choose sides or make new alliances...

But beware the wrath of the dictators!

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Below is the map of the action, grand in scale, but hopefully good for conquest and great battles!

Orange = Allied
Cyan = Axis
Red = Soviets
White = Italy
Magenta = Finland
Yellow = Romania
Green = Vichy France
Blue = Neutral

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

With the help of CIV masters like Tech and fairline, I have already laid the ground work
for what might be my most ambitious project with WW2 scens...I might ask for assistance
when it comes to creating batch files, or using Merc's utilities to allow multi-files to work...
In order to enable the unit/weather changes, which are so vital to WW2 history.

Any questions, please fire away - I will be updating this thread with info regularly!

30/1/08 = Map Image updated!

Blue Lion · January 13, 2008, 17:05

I wish you good luck for your very ambitious project. This is a gigantic task!

But why are Romania and Finland seperate civs and not Axis when your scenario starts in June 1941? And it seems, Italy has its own civ-colour too.

curtsibling · January 13, 2008, 18:09

Hi there, BL!
(nice animations, by the way!)

Italy, Romania and Finland all have their own agendas...
The civs are this way because I wanted to give the player a chance to play as a small and challenging nation.
Naturally, these micro-empires will have the chance to expand if they grab some weaker Soviet or Allied cities.

To avoid confusion, I think I will make the Axis (cyan) into the 'Greater Germany' faction.

Jerec · January 13, 2008, 18:25

I'm assuming Dalek Tyranny is completed...where is the finished version?

Quote:

using Merc's utilities to allow multi-files to work...

That means CivSwap?

Arthedain · January 13, 2008, 18:32

Wow! Finally a Dictator europe!

Btw, I noticed some errors in the map. Italy occupied Albania and most of greece during dec 1941. Crete was in German hands though). You might also want to recheck the cities of Romania (I'e the Hungarian part of Romania they got when joining the Axis and the Romanian occupation of Ukraine, Odessa. See maps in the links below to see what I'm talking about:
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...942_map_en.png
http://content.answers.com/main/cont...px-Rom1942.png

Edit: Don't forget to edit your first post to include Italy in the list of civs.

Mercator · January 13, 2008, 20:35

Quote:

Originally posted by curtsibling
using Merc's utilities to allow multi-files to work...

Assuming you do mean CivSwap... I am/was working on an update for CivSwap (thanks to techumseh). If I can get off my lazy ass again and finish that off, you probably won't need batch files anymore...

Jerec · January 14, 2008, 00:49

Quote:

Originally posted by Mercator

Assuming you do mean CivSwap... I am/was working on an update for CivSwap (thanks to techumseh). If I can get off my lazy ass again and finish that off, you probably won't need batch files anymore...

WHAT!!?! You mean there's a program that can top CivSwap and actually put batch files in the trash bin? Now that you've let the cat out of the bag, you had better finish it, or some people might be awfully put out...

curtsibling · January 14, 2008, 06:56

Quote:

Originally posted by Mercator

Assuming you do mean CivSwap... I am/was working on an update for CivSwap (thanks to techumseh). If I can get off my lazy ass again and finish that off, you probably won't need batch files anymore...

Looking forward to that - I will be working on various parts
of the scenario for a while, so there is no mega rush for the
utility, but is sounds excellent all the same!

curtsibling · January 14, 2008, 10:08

Quote:

Originally posted by Jerec
I'm assuming Dalek Tyranny is completed...where is the finished version?

That was done a while ago!

I'll see about getting it onto SL wiki!

curtsibling · January 14, 2008, 10:15

Quote:

Originally posted by Arthedain
Wow! Finally a Dictator europe!

About time, eh?

Quote:

Originally posted by Arthedain Btw, I noticed some errors in the map. Italy occupied Albania and most of greece during dec 1941. Crete was in German hands though). You might also want to recheck the cities of Romania (I'e the Hungarian part of Romania they got when joining the Axis and the Romanian occupation of Ukraine, Odessa. See maps in the links below to see what I'm talking about:
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...942_map_en.png
http://content.answers.com/main/cont...px-Rom1942.png

Cheers for the pointers and links!
This map represents the situation in June 1941,
so Romania would not own Odessa just yet.

I was going to post my current map, and then take advice
from people about what Balkan cities belong to who...I can
use CivCity to make the necessary changes...

Would you be up for helping me on the Balkan front?

Quote:

Originally posted by Arthedain Edit: Don't forget to edit your first post to include Italy in the list of civs.

Done - That was delirium of flu making me forget Italy!

curtsibling · January 14, 2008, 11:00

Here is the map file, with cities and rules, so the thing loads OK! (excuse the CIV2 vanilla units!)

If anyone can help me out with proper ownership of the Balkan cities or any mistakes, let me know!

Eivind IV · January 14, 2008, 11:01

Exiting!

Just for my curiosity, will the Germans in Romania fight under the German or the Romanian civ? And will the Afrika Korps fight under Italian or German command?

And regarding the Italian Adriatic, here's a nice wiki map indicating Italy (at it's peak) during ww2, indicating that Germany administered Athens and Crete only: http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...areNostrum.jpg

curtsibling · January 14, 2008, 11:05

Quote:

Originally posted by Eivind IV
Exiting!

Will the Germans in Romania fight under the German or the Romanian civ? And will the Afrika Korps fight under Italian or German command?

Cheers!

Romania will have it's own civ, and fight for the Germans, but the player can choose to break away...!

Also the DAK will be German-controlled, and based in Tripoli, which is German-owner for scen purposes...

curtsibling · January 14, 2008, 11:06

Quote:

Originally posted by Eivind IV
And regarding the Italian Adriatic, here's a nice wiki map indicating Italy (at it's peak) during ww2, indicating that Germany administered Athens and Crete only: http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...areNostrum.jpg

It is a good map! I am using it to reference what cities the Italians own.

Eivind IV · January 14, 2008, 11:07

Sorry, seem to have cross posted, I just edited my post with a map for Italian cities.

And if my opinion count for anything, it might be more apropriate to give the Italians control of the DAK, according to the Romanian presedence. And maybe Bulgaria could be merged with Romania?

yaroslav · January 14, 2008, 11:32

Great! Do the Allies have two cities in the south Spanish coast?

curtsibling · January 14, 2008, 11:40

One of those is Gibraltar, on the rock - And the other is a
desert tile, which looks similar to the Allied civ colour...

The Allies also control Lisbon too...

yaroslav · January 14, 2008, 11:56

Gibraltar I was guessing and it is fine, but I was wondering about what the British were doing in Almeria

(not that evil British Invaders don´t still try

- see this)

GhostOfDisco · January 14, 2008, 11:58

Actually, it looks more like a desert terrain square, but I can see why you could make that mistake.

Great map! I know that little over half seems to be given for to the Atlantic, but that's for convoys and stuff, so it's all good. Hope the AI won't freak out over it, though...

Looking forward to the scenario's release!

curtsibling · January 14, 2008, 12:28

Quote:

Originally posted by yaroslav
Gibraltar I was guessing and it is fine, but I was wondering about what the British were doing in Almeria

(not that evil British Invaders don´t still try

- see this)

Hoho!

Yes, fear the might of the Empire - If it can find the right place to attack!

curtsibling · January 14, 2008, 12:29

Quote:

Originally posted by GhostOfDisco
Actually, it looks more like a desert terrain square, but I can see why you could make that mistake.

Great map! I know that little over half seems to be given for to the Atlantic, but that's for convoys and stuff, so it's all good. Hope the AI won't freak out over it, though...

Looking forward to the scenario's release!

Thanks, Ghost!

I am also hoping the AI does not go mental over such a mega expanse of ocean - !

But since the Allies are on both sides of the map, it might help...Fingers crossed!

fairline · January 14, 2008, 13:21

Looks good C.

You could probably lose some of Africa; anything S. of the Qattara depression isn't needed. You might think about truncating the N. Atlantic as well. The time taken for convoys to cross can be regulated by transport movement points, and it would be worthwhile focusing on Europe at the expense of a realistic expanse of Atlantic Ocean.

curtsibling · January 14, 2008, 13:38

Quote:

Originally posted by fairline
Looks good C.

You could probably lose some of Africa; anything S. of the Qattara depression isn't needed. You might think about truncating the N. Atlantic as well. The time taken for convoys to cross can be regulated by transport movement points, and it would be worthwhile focusing on Europe at the expense of a realistic expanse of Atlantic Ocean.

Looking at the map, I see what you mean, fairline...! Africa and the Atlantic could indeed lose a slice.

Sadly at this stage, it would mean placing all the cities all over again - A right gruelling task!

But if the AI ends up taking tours to the Sahara or pleasure cruises away from battle, then I might
have to do this anyway...Later on I might try some alternative Euro maps and see what I can do.

Arthedain · January 15, 2008, 04:21

What you've done with the cities now is accurate, though Ljubljana should belong to the Germans. I'm not 100% sure but most maps I've seen put it in Greater Germany. Take a look:
http://www.humanitas-international.o...s/campsmap.jpg
http://news.bbc.co.uk/nol/shared/spl.../maps/1941.gif

Edit: shouldn't Brasov be Hungarian? And Suez is a bit too much to the south.

curtsibling · January 15, 2008, 05:30

Cheers, Arthedain!
Seems that Ljubljana was owned by the Italians in 1941, but handed over to the Reich in 1943.

PS
Brasov is definitely part of Romania - Your previous linked map shows this too.

Arthedain · January 15, 2008, 12:19

I stand corrected!

Interesting info about Ljubljana. I love how civ2 teaches you new bits of history all the time. On Swedish wikipedia it said Ljubljana was German from 1941, but English wikipedia (which is always more relaiable) says it was Italian in 1941 and German in 1943, like you said.

curtsibling · January 15, 2008, 12:26

I tend to be wary about wikipedia, as it is sometimes opinion pretending to be facts.

But in this case, other sources support the fact that Italy took over Slovenia in 1941.

Only in Sept 1943, when Italy collapsed, did Germany occupy.

Followed by the communist forces in 1945-46...

Not much luck to be had in WW2 Slovenia!

curtsibling · January 15, 2008, 12:45

Today, in Dictatorville:
------------------------

Some notes about what is going on!

I am putting the finishing touches to the unit placement, should be a nice little opening battle!
Then I will begin to make various GFX files for wintertime and for evolving units as time goes on!

Various big (but not boringly big) armies of the Axis stand poised on the Soviet borders, ready to
blast into Stalin's front garden. The Russian player should be prepared for a few losses, and this
is where the unit balance has to be just right...I want the Axis to make headway, but still give
the Soviet player a chance to strike back or hold on until winter.

The expanse of land is big, so this time the Soviets can really enact the policy of 'terrain for time.'
All the while, the North African campaign will be raging in the South, as Italy comes to grips with
the Allies. Germany has limited units there to, in order to lend a hand, but getting reinforcements
into the battle area will be tricky due to British raiders...So make every unit count!

The Desert War is host to some unique units that will only spawn in various cities. The Germans get
their special 'DAK Pz III', the Brits get a Matilda and Kittyhawk fighter...These are pretty good
units, but will not be replaced rapidly...Waste them at your peril!

The Allies are gearing up to hold off the Axis in Africa, and also get special 'Supply' units across
the lake ASAP, as when the USA enters the war proper in early 1942 these units will become US
troops. These unbuildable supply units can also be used to rush-build important projects too.

The smaller civs like Italy and Finland have their own infantry, but tend to build generic units, but
with a few German types flung in for good measure...And if a minor Axis civ is loyal, they might even
get free units from the Reich in the shape of a potent armour or air unit...

Some people want more challenge from scenarios, and that is what playing as the small Axis powers can
provide...A player can set their own goals, and see how they fare. Finland could try and take over all
terrain East of Viipuri, or Romania could build a Balkan empire! Survival against the odds will be the
main objective...And a totally different game from that of the bigger civs...

More to come!

McMonkey · January 15, 2008, 13:18

I'm glad you have included the smaller powers. I always enjoy the more challenging smaller civs with limited but tough objectives.

curtsibling · January 15, 2008, 13:41

That's the plan, old chap!